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Dating is really hard.

First you have to find someone with whom you share a mutual attraction, then you have to make sure that you want the same thing in terms of commitment.

But the hardest part is meeting someone. As a result, many have turned to online dating sites. In fact, a third of recently married couples met online. They’re also less likely to break up.

But online dating is different for men and women Online Dating - Men Don't Get It And Women Don't Understand Online Dating - Men Don't Get It And Women Don't Understand Do online dating websites work? It's time for a frank discussion! What I learned from interviews was that online dating is equally painful for men and for women, but for very different reasons. Read More . As the saying goes: “Men are afraid women will laugh at them. Women are afraid men will kill them.”

While it is true that straight women get more attention on dating sites than men, that doesn’t always mean it’s positive attention from safe potential partners 5 Signs You Shouldn't Date That Guy You Met On The Internet 5 Signs You Shouldn't Date That Guy You Met On The Internet I was an online player. Here are the tricks I used to win women's hearts – and how to spot them. Read More . As an experiment I set up accounts on three of the more popular free dating websites, then spoke to some women about their experiences.

OkCupid

When someone says online dating, one of the first sites that comes to mind is OkCupid. It is estimated that there are about 30 million total users, with roughly 1 million unique users logging in every day.

It goes without saying that OkCupid has one of the better reputations of more popular free dating websites for having a wide variety of quality users. However, OkCupid has many not-so-great users as well, and it’s not uncommon for women to have the misfortune of encountering them, and in the past, I have as well.

In total, I received 11 messages with 218 visitors. Mostly, they were just guys saying hi. A few were a little more forward, and two were straight-up aggressive.

Despite Casual Kiss being kind of scammy, with only 3000 monthly visitors, I decided to give it a try all the same – and I wasn’t entirely disappointed. I joined February 4th, around 7 AM, and received a total of one vote, two winks, and six messages. The messages were all nice, although one user messaged me three times.

PlentyofFish is perhaps the most popular online dating sites out there, with an estimated 6 million pageviews a month and 76 million users (a little less than the entire population of Turkey). It’s no surprise that I received nearly twice as many messages on Plenty of Fish than OkCupid and Casual Kiss combined.

In total, I received 34 messages, all of which were very nice. I never replied to any of the messages, however there were a few men who messaged me twice despite that, in an attempt to get a response. 497 people said that they wanted to meet me on PoF’s Meet Me feature.

While my experiences here were relatively tame, that doesn’t mean it’s the case for every woman. In fact, it’s not uncommon at all for women to be threatened for refusing to send nudes or insulted when they say they’re not interested in the man messaging them.

I spoke to a few friends about their experiences with online dating websites. One friend brought up a message where a man had told her that because she was a ‘woman of size’, she ‘must suck good ****’. Another simply sent me this screenshot.

Others in the past have conducted similar experiments, setting up fake accounts on free dating websites and recording the messages they received. Cracked’s Alli Reed set up ‘the worst online dating profile ever’ and still received heaps of messages from men who wanted only to hook up with the terrible woman she had created. Continuing to be horrible did not dissuade any of them.

There are also instances of men, believing women ‘have it easy’ on dating websites, setting up fake profiles and being shocked by the messages they receive. One of the most notable of these is a reddit user who set up a fake profile and didn’t last two hours. He came away with the realization that women have it much, much harder on these sites:

I figured I would get some weird messages here and there, but what I got was an onslaught of people who were, within minutes of saying hello, saying things that made me as a dude who spends most of his time on 4chan uneasy.

I personally have had some experience with OkCupid before this experiment, which weren’t completely positive.

When I was living in southern Oregon, the dating scene at my college wasn’t that great. A lot of people, including me, turned to online dating, and OkCupid was all the rage. As I was serious about finding someone, I uploaded a lot of pictures of myself, had a very thorough profile, and received a lot of attention. A lot of it was like the above. Eventually, it got to be too much and I closed my profile. I haven’t used dating sites to try to find men to date ever since.

First off, telling a woman about what you would like to do to her sexually without any prompting is not a compliment. It’s creepy, and in some instances really scary – not a turn-on by any means. Neither is asking for, or offering to send, nudes (unless they were not discussed first). No one likes unwanted sexual advances.

Insulting other women, while looking for a woman, won’t help your chances of finding someone. That’s another turn-off.

Don’t be this guy and send this as your first message to a woman.

If you see a picture of a woman you like, take the time to read her profile. Find out what she’s interested in. When messaging a woman without bothering to learn about her through her profile, it may come across as you not caring about her as a person – no one wants that.

Make your intentions known. If you’re interested in something casual, tell her or put it in your profile. If you’d like a casual encounter, make that known as well. And if you’re serious about finding someone, make sure you don’t come across as too aggressive.

Finally, take no for an answer. No means no, and you’re not going to be able to ‘convince’ anyone to fall in love with you, and reacting with anger and threats when someone isn’t interested won’t help you.

Try to get to know someone before meeting them. Watch for any red flags, such as disregarding your boundaries and not respecting your feelings.

When going to meet someone in person, it helps to suggest you both bring along a friend. This may help relieve the anxiety of the other person, plus it’s a safeguard for you both in case something happens. Also, be sure to meet in a public place and to stay in a public place. If you’re going alone, be sure to tell a friend where you’re going and what you’ll be doing.

For a first meeting, be sure to stay sober.

Don’t send out money, especially overseas.

Finally, don’t give out personal information – your phone number, email address, or even full name – right away. If you really want to talk on the phone with someone, consider getting a Google voice number 5 Cool Things You Can Do With Google Voice 5 Cool Things You Can Do With Google Voice Read More . Finally, read up on ways to make your online dating experience better 4 Tools For Easier & Safer Online Dating [Google Chrome] 4 Tools For Easier & Safer Online Dating [Google Chrome] Dating has gone digital. Once considered a realm inhabited only by the socially awkward, online dating is now just another tool in the toolbox, no matter whether you’re looking for a hook-up or your soulmate. Read More .

Casual Kiss is full of scammers, so that is a website I suggest avoiding. OkCupid is renowned for having a wide variety of users, although I received more messages and views on PlentyofFish. However, the problem with a lot of free dating websites such as these is that many of the users, the male users especially, are looking for sex.

If you’re willing to spend a little bit of money, paid websites like Zoosk, eHarmony, and Match are fantastic and you’re bound to find someone who is as interested in commitment as you are. If not, as trashy as they can be, OkCupid and Plenty of Fish are both decent websites. There are also other great dating apps What Is The Best Dating App For Android? What Is The Best Dating App For Android? Dating apps have come a long way, and there are actually some great options on Android. Give these fantastic apps a try! Read More you can use in place of websites, like Tinder.

Have you had any bad experiences with online dating? What about good experiences? Leave me a comment below and tell me about it!

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I'm a good looking 6'1" muscled, athletic, green eyed guy that has no trouble attracting women in real life. I have a good job, own a home want kids. I work third shift and travel a lot. I'm also an engineer so it's pretty much %100 male at my work.

On OK cupid I was listed as the second most popular guy in an area with 2.5 million people.

I send out well thought out messages after reading profiles and i'm lucky to get a reply to %10. usually from much less attractive women than I usually date. After talking for a while I ask them out.

This is excluding the offers from gay men who messaged me more often then women (I'm not gay and not interested)

At this point I have sent out 100 well thought out messages, in other words one a night for over three months on average.

Of the 4 dates I had in a year.

One was old enough to be my mother, I was probably in kindergarten when her picture was taken. I look young for my age so we didn't even look like a couple.

Two were morbidly obese, I'm not looking for a super model but I'm also not looking for someone who can't climb a flight of stairs and is going to have major health issues, we lead completely different lifestyles, my profile states that I bicycled 1000 miles last summer and lists rock climbing, spelunking and kayaking as hobbies. Yes, we may read the same novels, but I do it on top of that 200 foot cliff I climbed.

One was married! Nope! Thought this was the one, and asked her for a second date, She wanted to go home with me. I told he I really don't want to move that fast, I don't' sleep around but once we got to know each other better. She said she really couldn't' as he husband would be back from a work trip.. Um, seriously I think you might have mentioned that before accepting a date. I'm glad I didn't kiss her.

I was polite and nice to all, I paid for 4 very expensive meals (average $200) and even some hard to get symphony tickets. I have a yearly membership as a patron so no added cost to me but still.

I left out a lot of pretty bad stuff, fake profiles, scams, etc we all get this stuff I'm sure.

Because of my lifestyle I have a choice between online dating and being single, at this point I'm being single.

It’s a shame that we’re on different continents- you sound like the man I was hoping to meet when I decided to try online dating following my divorce. I joined a site and received hundreds of requests within two days. Have tried weeding out the ones that didn’t match the profile I was looking for ( and really, my expectations were not unreasonable. I don’t want someone my father’s age, or an 18 year old looking for a “sugar mummy “ or a creep who would send me not only photos but VIDEOS of his , well, “nocturnal activities “. ) I was polite and friendly to all but all I got was disgusting offers.) My profile picture is honest, I am attractive, slim, 5’9, dress well, have a good job, a house, a SUV. I love to entertain, can definitely hold a good conversation , a good cook, yet all I got was horrible “hey sexy, are you interested in “insert disgusting offer”. From a woman’s point of you, what gives these men the right to even reach out to women who are way out of their league?? Or to think that I’m interested in an enlarged photo of his genitalia? Why would they think that I would be happy to support a “sensitive artist i.e. someone can’t be bothered to find a job “ or a 68 year old “lonely man “ who is older than my Dad? I went on one date, thought it went well even though the guy was horribly nervous, chewed his nails to the quick then never responded to my “thank you for lunch, I had a nice time, hoping to see you again “ message? If this is all what is left out there then I’ll just stick to walking the dog and be single.

I have tried multiple on line dating sites. I have found there is no such thing as a free dating site, If you use your credit card your asking for trouble at your bank. Women only want your bank and your comments about sex are necessarily true. Women have said to me let's f. but you need a pass or a credit card age check. WHAT A LIE. It seems to be the same for all sites. Whatever happened to just meeting in public and talking. When I suggest this, the response is. you might be a creep or a killer or a rapist or whatever. WELL WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU. AN ANGEL FROM GOD. I am not perfect and yes I like sex, and a lot of it. But this never makes for a relationship or to me, show the thanks or appreciation I want to give to a woman. I want to hear her opinions, ides and thoughts. But they just want my genital size and bank account size. DO NOT POTRAY WOMEN AS INNOCENT LITTLE GIRLS LOOKING FOR A KNIGHT IN SHINNING ARMOUR. Nor as being innocent of their actions in seeking men. I have had some sick stuff from woman too.

What do you think about all these sex sites and why so many?? If you are not looking to get laid don't go there. If you are there, don't be surprised at some of the responses.

Take a look in your own mirror. I can. and I am far from perfect, but I do not need your money as a women, your troubles as a women or to hurt or harm you as a woman.

You try and be nice to a woman on line and you just get what your looking for. f.

What is so wrong with meeting in public or talking on the phone first?

I have tried several of the sites above. Oh its great if you are some well off good looking guy. But us Joe Smoes out there get inboxes full of girls but we can't look at them until we pay up. The minute we do, suddenly no one talks to you. Online dating is for the well to do, smooth talkers, and the good looking.

For guys who are genuine and respond to womens' profiles (not just their pictures) it would be nice to receive a reply such as, "Not feeling chemistry, but thanks for the message." I acknowledge the frustration and fear of being harassed by unwanted sexual advances. The frustration of men comes from being earnest about responding thoughtfully and then getting no reply whatsoever. These men don't reply back nastily, but just accept that there won't be a reply. But it would be nice to get a reply either way.

Nice post. I have 1 question. Do these tips helpful for long term dating?

On ok Cupid I once had a guy message me they wanted to dress up in a French maid costume and be my table. I kid you not.

Tips for guys that don’t hurt women, send rude degrading emails. Don’t waste your time, $$ or energy with online dating. Guaranteed you’ll pull your hair out or be committed to an insane asylum.

Should hear mine I'm a 40 year old man I joined one site and got a run around now I have 50+ sites argh but I just got a call from one this morning begging me to upgrade because several VIPs can't contact me hey I just told the truth not great but it's true at least how many people get called from sites begging to upgrade I told them to close it but what a rush I have hundreds of women from around the world trying to contact me but hey real story I have no credit card so I can't talk there anyway just thought I'd share and see if anyone else has ever been called by the site themselves with a similar story maybe it happens all the time lol

Interesting article but I do feel it's a bit one sided I just don't have a problem with that. For women it is a more pressing issue of safety. Anyway, I tried Match for a year. My view is it was a total waste of money not counting the value of learning that fact. I would say I'm a good guy but then again who wouldn't. For what it's worth, my experience was reading over 600 profiles and I couldn't even guess on how many I viewed. Most of those were dreadful tripe or just plain lazy. Despite that I ended up sending about 150 attempts to start a conversation in hopes of finding more substance. Most of these were along the lines of "Hello, I see you like art museums. Do you have a favorite artist or style? I'm a fan of impressionists and really like VanGogh." I did on occasion have so little to work with but found them attractive and compatible enough I'd try "You have a very kind smile. Would you care to talk a little?" At first I'd get absolutely nothing but an occasional view and messages from Match telling me I could pay extra to guarantee she can respond. About half way through I decided to try something, I added my income to my profile and maintained the same number of views, started getting winks and photo likes with still few reads/responses and just as many solicitations from Match. Next I deleted the summary I had crafted and put in a generic personality-less one resulting in a small decline in winks/likes, same number of reads but no responses and no changes on Match solicitations. I deleted the income and everything but the Match solicitations ended. I ended with a shorter summary and no income. In the end I had 4 actual responses, about 15 read notifications without response and at least 2 solicitations from Match a day. Not a good percentage to be sure. Maybe I'm just a horrible guy but if not then I have a theory about what is going on. I'm thinking when Match started having the men pay so the women can read that the number of women with paid accounts dropped. From my sample I'd estimate only 20% even had the ability to read the message I sent. I'm guessing the likes/winks were an attempt to get me to pay the fee for them. Interesting to me that salary was a bigger driver than summary. I guess some women are just looking for a paycheck, I just didn't realize how many on Match were. Unfortunately I was trying to find a friend and partner in life. Maybe I will someday. Hopefully my experience will help other descent guys thinking of Match. Good luck all.

There's just something's that nature didn't intend/short cut and Ive always had the instinct that this one of them.

With finding your partner you can't "try" or aggressively seek it.

It has to just happen from a look across the room, in places you enjoy going, yep that's right.

Unfortunately I still am on Match. As my subscription ended I actually found someone that was talking to me. I didn't figure it was serious but we were talking and I liked that. I tried to send alternate means of keeping the conversation going with no luck. After the subscription ended I got several notifications of messages and finally decided it was worth the cash just to keep the pen pal. On renewing my account (about 3 days) I messaged her and she responded that I should renew so we could keep talking. When I told her I already had the conversation ended and she blocked me. My suspicion is that was some form of customer retention activity but maybe I am just paranoid.

At this point I have stopped messaging women. I update my profile summary periodically and wait to see if anyone has interest in me so I feel I am not aggressively seeking anything. So far nothing and I don't expect there will be any until the subscription gets close to expiring. Hopefully I finally learned my lesson on that.

I love the idea of finding someone that way but it is a fairy tale from what I have seen. Hopefully it's a fairy tale someone else gets to live. I like that idea.

Uh.. It's how it's been done since the dawn of man and still being done today. If you feel a computer and "profile" is some kind of required to find a truly loving relationship wishing you all the best with that attitude.

I'm not saying you don't want to set yourself up, or go out to places where you could be noticed or approached. But it also happens when your not "desperately" chasing it either like people are online.

Another reason I don't favor online dating is it sets most up with this "let me look for grass that might be greener on the side" type mentality

Strong relationships are built strong, seasoned and nurtured with time and care -- there is no grass is greener on the other side.

Online dating for a decent male is a straight ticket to depression and self loathing.

Wow! Not leaning towards the troubles women go through with online dating. I'm sure they're are plenty disgusting and immoral/sexist men online. Yes, women must be on their guard. A LOT OF BAD MEN OUT THERE! No bad women of course. I've had some success with some wonderful ladies, some are not so nice. Either a guy gets a reply from a gal he's attracted to or "cricket". or head games. If she is attractive she has the pick of the bunch. It's a crap shoot. Not all guys are bad unfortunately bad apples can ruin many.

I received death threats 4rm a man I met on POF, after I spoke w him several times over the cell. I cancelled meeting him & he sent me at least 20 very threatening & disgusting text msg. One was a sex act, one a pic of his bowel movement. He said he will find me & kill me. He's a phychopath & my gun stays w me now at all times. I thank God I didn't meet this phyco, I have filed a police report & saved the text msgs. I blocked him after the texts wouldn't stop. I've spoken w several men & when I felt they weren't the one I moved on as did they. Women please please b careful - have the long talks letting them talk more - they will tell u all u need without knowing. Follow ur gut. I never spoke about sex w this freak but he accused me of playing sex games. One pic was a woman's butt filled w sperm he said "eat my cum out her ass bitch" "die bitch" "I will find u & kill u" . Terrifying that I met someone straight out a serial killer movie or criminal minds. He even sat on a xerox machine & sent a pic of that. I hope he gets locked up. Mind u this man "seemed " normal until I stopped talking to him.

I was sent 2 messages by a disappointed man in his late 60's. The messages were abusive, and scared the hell out of me!! I am no longer interested in online dating sites. Men have unrealistic expectations for women my age. And most look like serial killers. They need to learn how to take more flattering pics of themselves. I also encountered at least 6 fraudulent male profiles.

I find that men don't even look at your profile. I have alot of specifics and they still message me. I even state that I want my race,no hook up, want long term. What I'm intrested in. Yet they always ask what do you like to do.

hi friends. i totally agree on the major dating issues facing men and women alike. i like this new website, though not very popular as yet and not too may people. but it has potential. www.see2date.com they claim to be totally genuine and since they provide free video dating without having to share phone numbers , fb ids. i kinda feel safer. have a look

I got scammed out of $2600. I want to know if I have any recourse or anyone to report it to. That left me devastated. He gave me he bank account and I head the large balance he has. I looked it up online. Its a real bank. Can you take a telebanking line?

Dating stinks. Not all guys are arrogant, self absorbed jerks wanting one night stands. So, it seems all men are thrown into the same mix of dirtbags. I've dated a lot of ladies and yes I have my standards. Who wants to settle. The gals I've dated were attractive and my ex wife was good looking. The head games played by women, empty profile or blatant ignores makes online dating a serious crapshoot. "Lets go for coffee" crickets. very frustrating.

Yeah while I have some sympathy for the douches you guys have met I still feel the need to say cry me an ocean to this article. I stopped reading at the point she said she had 397 messages and didn't reply to any of them. Yep think about that for a second and welcome to the other side of the dating game! You know how happy I or most guys would be to have so much attention from girls on dating sites lol? Tell you what why don't you just try it from the mens side. Get a decent picture of one of your guy friends, go and read some profiles of girls you see on there, what little they put down outside of I like friends family and traveling. Now try to send them a message about something you have in common. Then just keep a tally of every time you do that and repeat the process about 500 times. Why 500 times you say well because I can almost guarantee you no matter what I say she isn't going to respond. Hell I'm kind of wondering why I'm not asking women for naked pics right up front at least they get responses it would seem!

As a woman 55 I started using various dating websites 7 years ago & have met nothing but, emotionaly troubled men.

Man who dated 3 years refused to commit, I broke up.

Man who dated 6 months refused to commit, I broke up.

Man who dated 3 times wanted casual sex only, he refused to spend money on dates, I stopped meeting him.

Man who dated 2 months wanted casual sex, refused to take down dating website profile, online & texting all the time, I called him out & he dissapeared.

Man who pressured me to move in after dating 6 weeks, couldnt get through first dissagreement , I moved out.

I have met so many men online who are just unattractive & narcissistic, judged me on one date & never spoke to me again.

I have met so many men online who are only interested in you until they win you over then they reject you. Or only interested in putting you in the spot to service them sexualy while they scout around for something better, thats ridiculous.

I have been sent nasty pics, texts & emails, called a prude, stood up & jumped on dates by men who are emotionaly unstable.

I just met an ex airforce veteran who went from saying on date one that he was looking for marrige in five yrs to saying on date four that just because we talk on the phone & met for dinner which he paid for doesnt mean were dating. He pressured for sex on third date all while revealing he is ex alcoholic who attends AA meetings, rambles & was diagnosed with PTSD &

HSV with two failed marriges plus other relationships. He claimed he didnt want to attend church with me as he didnt want anyone to think he is married. I tested negative for HSV & not willing to take that from him plus dealing with a vet with PTSD is stressful beyond belief. I called him out on his bs & let him go.

I have met a handful of men during happy hour at a nice restaurant near my home,

one is 70 yrs & unattractive, acts like a player, wont pay for a date but tries to get together behind closed doors. One agressive guy followed me out to my car once, very scarry. New flash, women dont want to sleep with strange men they just met.

I am tired of guys who want to meet for drinks & instantly hookup, its not the 70S anymore & I dont want to contract herpes from a stranger. You dont have sex with a stranger then try to wrap a relationship around it, you create a relationahip them top it off with sex.

Men shouldnt juggle women its always obvious when I meet a guy whos getting physical with a women (s) he feels zero for and we cant develope any trust because hes tied up getting off or doesnt know who he should allow a comnection to take place with & he just flounders & cant be taken serious.

Men need to calm down, stop accepting easy sex that takes their time & effort to maintain while the great match slips thru their fingers.

I was messaged by someone who thought/tried convincing me we should meet and have sex first to see if we were compatible and if there was even a point in dating each other. While I agree a healthy sex life is an important part of a relationship I was shocked at the suggestion.

Most guys who just want a hook up will say so but he tried insisting he really wanted a relationship, we just had to pass the good sex test first.

Then there are the guys who say they they want to meet and "just cuddle" at your place or theirs on the first date. And can't understand why there is a list of problems with this. You want to do more than just cuddle, so just say that in your profile rather than wasting a girls time. And I'm never ever going to have someone come to my place or go to their place for a first date. That's just dumb.

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I've been currently using dating sites again and right now its a living hell for me. I agree with the guy below that being alone (for the past decade for me) has been quite maddening. I'm a 39 year old male that lives alone in a 2 bedroom apartment, and I've never had kids. Getting severe bouts of depression every once in while and some very emotionally crushing anguish about what could have been.

And the worst part is. I HAD a GREAT relationship in 2001 that started online using Match.com in a chat room(and I didn't even have to pay a subscription for it). It lasted almost 4 years and was very serious that we wanted to get married. Something just clicked once we got to know each other better. And unfortunately we ended up mutually agreeing to break up due to some extremely horrible external pressure and didn't want to see each other suffer. Nobody cheated, nobody hated the other, and it wasn't an issue with our families. Thank you economic "recession". She even wanted to find a job to keep us afloat, but due to our situation it wouldn't have been good for her being a foreign national not legally registered to work. She recently got in touch with me again after 10 years to catch up and see how I was doing. If it weren't for the fact that her life has advanced much more than mine, it would have been no trouble for us to get back together. Unfortunately I'm still a bachelor, and she's been married for the past 7+ years with a 5 year old son. I'm not getting anywhere involved with her again except on a friendship basis. Her husband is providing her with the life I wanted to, and she has the family life that we could have had. And I refuse to be involved romantically at all. The time has passed, and the clock cannot be turned back.

It's been hard as hell trying to find that kind of loving and understanding relationship again. I'm not expecting the same exact thing as what I had. just someone who see me for who I am, and I see her for who she is and we accept each other.

My recent experiences on the dating website I use has been pretty pathetic. I received one direct response from what appears to have been a scammer, as their profile has been removed within a day of being put up. I've only gotten 2 smiles (one from the scammer). The one reply I received from a woman I wrote, apparently she was looking for sexual relationship only. I didn't entertain that idea any further and informed her of a site she could use to satisfy her needs if she wasn't looking for natural dating. Another woman responded to a message I initiated and while this one seemed normal. hasn't responded back except that one time.

I'm worried that I as a man looking for a real relationship that results in marriage, I will end dying childless. My mother hasn't been much help as she believes that for some reason I should be able to have children when I'm 60-70-80. I calculated my life expectancy and I told her I needed to at least no later than my early 40s as there would be another 20 years to raise a child into reasonable adulthood and not be so old when (and if there may be grandchildren) I'll still be able to function.

While I don't expect women to be naive and have no discretion in responding to the "good" men that write them, they need to at the very least to let us know they're not interested by responding with a "I'm not interested but thank you." or "I've found someone on this site, but thank you" so us guys can keep moving forward. No response is equal to "maybe she didn't read it or get to see it" in guy logic. Men do have more competition than women. I want to ask women. how much money have you spent on monthly subscriptions to start writing a man? Or even better yet. how many men have you initiated contact with instead of the other way around? I've sent 39 messages in the past 3 weeks alone and only got 2 legitimate responses.

I have been on on line dating for just over a year. Unfortunately no luck so far. I have met a couple of scammers and thankfully caught on before investing too much time. I am a bit older (53) very secure and confident. I consider myself a decent, good looking woman who is fit with just a few extra pounds. In the past year I have sent messages at least 20-30 men and gotten 0 responses back. I have received a lot of messages asking to " hook up" etc. and approximately 10 or so men that seemed decent enough to start conversations with. I have been ghosted by 3 of them when I thought the conversations were going well. actually did go on a couple of first dates only to never hear from the guys again ( and that was after a good night kiss and an email from them saying they had a great time. ) I have learned to listen to those little red flags that 20 years ago I would have ignored. Yes I have had the messages straight up about sex but I just ignore those I get interests from guys that live thousands of miles away even though I clearly state I am not interested in a long distance relationship. The guys I message are ones who's profiles interest me and who I see some common interests. But as I said before, I rarely get an answer. It leaves me wondering just what are they looking for and perhaps I am just not "hot" enough for them. That's ok, I am still happy, still me, still single, just a bit perplexed but I have not given up.

I was on the dating site OkCupid. It was awful. I met this Australian man who profile name was Ayapi. He was asking for sex in two minutes of talking to me. He also was on Plenty Of Fish. He have a sex website online with a lot of nude women. He was trying to get me to take nude pictures and videos. I met other scammers on OkCupid as well. One went to jail for scamming people out of money. They don't care who use their site. It's a danger for the women and for some men

Online dating has NEVER worked for me, even when I was serious about it I was meeting the guys who were serial daters and not looking for a relationship or con artist or scammers who were looking to mooch off of a women and then of course the perverted guys that were looking to hook up, they made it known immediately what they wanted to do with you sexually. It sucked to me. I'm happy for the people who go on to find real relationships from these sites, I've had zero luck.

The female you used was a doughy, 20 year old Asian/Hispanic chick in Southern California at that? I'm not surprised at your results. The men weren't feisty with your profile because it's not what they are lusting after. Men are only angry at profiles of the trophy girls who respond with iciness, insults or silence. She must be thin, usually blonde with light eyes, primarily Caucasian. Use that profile pic and you'll see the firestorm of interest. With the chick you used the men will only be nice because they're not ego invested in her at all. Also you didn't turn any of the men down to get a response. So you didn't give them a reason to invest in you. Just wait until you turn guys down as a blonde. That's when you better put up your photon force fields.

All those blogs you read of women being confronted with nasty emails are basically white chicks bragging that they are the coveted princesses in this country. They have a litany of suitors after them who see them as dating status symbols and they set up blogs basically to complain to the world that the population of men isn't picture perfect like in a Maxim magazine. The white chicks are so used to the endless attention they make a sport of rejecting these guys or luring the guys on with empty promises for fun. They literally spend their online presence cherry-picking the one guy with abs and a tattoo while mocking the remaining 90% of men that want them. It's this random chaos and disrespect the men deal with when pursuing their dream girls that is the source of all online vitriol. So when the girls turn these guys down they get revenge emails like balls of fire. Your chick is just a boring safe brunette so who cares what she does?

The chick you put up isn't anyone's idea of a girlfriend, more like a one night stand. That's why you got no controversy from her. Try again.

I've only used okcupid. A woman, 29 years old, been on for 6 months. My experience is not very pleasant as well. I find it strange, that so many men here say, that they are looking for a relationship. My experience tells me, that about 99% of men on the website are looking for casual no strings attached relationship.

Yes, its true, that most women get lots of attention, but that doesn't mean anything. All girls that i know, want to find an actual boyfriend, and hopefully, eventually, someone to move in with, get married, have kids etc. But the vast majority of the guys just want to "chill and netflix". Sometimes, i feel like women are a bit more honest. If we don't respond, we are not interted - that's it. Sorry, we can't be interested in every single person that messages us. Sometimes, there might be nothing wrong with you, but we all have our types and dealbreakers. I keep finding guys who seem interested in me, but whenever things get too serious for their liking, they run away like crazy. I'd rarher be ignored, than led on till i start developing feelings just to have my heart broken.

I'm not even talking about numerous people asking if i want to come to their place tonight or if i want to be their slave or want them to be my slave or if i'm into oral sex right of the bat. I'd rather see that and just block them, than meeting someone who seems nice and genuine, and then to find out they are just players, use me or just not ready for a relationship. I haven't had chemistry with most of the people I met, so we never went on the 2nd date. But here are 3 guys, that i thought we were getting somewhere with, and they all left me heartbroken:

1. The first guy i met was ok. I was recently out of a 5 year relationship, he was out of a long relationship too. We had too many drinks and ended up having sex pretty fast. I thought he'd think i'm way too easy and will never talk to me again. Instead, we started seeing each other regularly. I wasn't that much into him, but i was still not recovered from my past relationship and, i guess, wanted to have someone there for me. He was in a similar position, so it all seemed to be working well. Eventually, he started treating me better and better. We never talked about being exclusive, defining our relationship, yet we'd spend lots of time together, we'd go out, hold hands, kiss and make out in public with no problem, he was making me dinners, help with manly stuff around the house etc. So i have slowly started falling for him. I even made a house party once, and invited him, and he came and met all of my friends. It lasted for about a month. One day i was driving, and saw him walking and holding hands with another girl (and we live in a big city and not in the same area. What are the chances?). I confronted him about it later, and he said how he never said he wanted a relationship, he is just out of one, and he enjoys his time with me, but he is not ready for a new one and wants to see what's out there.

2. I didn't like the 2nd guy i met right away. He wasn't physically attractive to me, but he was really funny and interesting to talk to. I would have loved him to be my friend if we haven't met on the dating website. He kept asking me out. I decided to go out with him a few more times, just because he was fun to be around, but never felt any chemistry. Even felt bad for leading him on, but kept seeing other guys. He started pursing me like crazy, he was very very nice to me, so eventually i have started liking him. I have enjoyed being treated like a princess and thought to myself "wow, this guy is really nice and is really into me, who else would treat me like that?". And i decided to give it a chance and started developing feelings too. After 2 months, we were hanging out one evening, and he started going on and on about how he can't believe that he met someone so amazing online, how he did't expect this to happen, how he is sick of online dating and doesn't wanna see anyone else. So we talked and decided to make it serious and delete our profiles in front of each other. So all was great, no problems, fights or other issues. 2 weeks after he sends me a text cancelling our weekend plans, and telling me he thinks this relationship won't work out, and its getting too serious and he is just not ready for it, and how things are fine, but its not exactly what he is looking for. Again, why start and waste 2 months of my life?

3. The last guy, was actually the first one i have liked instantly. I wasn't expecting that, but i really liked him the moment i met him. He seemed interested too. He complained to me about online dating from male point of view, how most of the women he met are boring. He is highly educated and is very picky about intelligence of women he dates, and he said he was amazed by me, because he felt it was so easy to talk to me right away, i'm smart and attractive. He was asking me out every 3-4 days which was unusual and it told me he is really into me. He was also very nice to me and we could talk forever. He has to wake up early for work, but we were still talking and making out till late when we saw each other. After 3 weeks, i had crazy feelings for him, and he seemed to have too. He canceled one of the dates for seemingly legit reason. I was cool about it, and told him that its ok, and we can see each other some other time. After that, he became very distant. Disappeared for a few days, then messaged again apologizing telling me about the problems he had. Then he would just randomly message me every few days, but never offered to go out again. And eventually just stopped messaging me.

I think men and women gave different problems with online dating, but we ha e it equally hard. Guys don't get responses, women find players

I completely agree with what a lot of men are saying. I was married 30 years only to be violently attacked by an alcoholic wife. I set myself out there and the women just play games. They say stupid things and just look for attention. I'm seriously disappointed in what appears to be the feminist movement in this country. They try to use their sexual prowess instead of their intelligence, which most are seriously lacking, and again, play games. They are not serious and don't care about a good relationship. I'm sure it's true there are a lot of men jerks but we are all stereotyped that way. Please be ladies OK? Have some respect for the opposite sex and if you're not serious just stay the heck away all right? There are good men like me out there. And you ladies that look so good in your photographs are just absolutely narcissistic and hideous with the way you speak to us. Please get over yourselves and take your meaningless time wasting profiles down and go gaggle in the mirror at yourself. It's really too bad. I have been giving this a good shot for months and actually have made a few good friends but have run into so many Queen bees that I am ready to give up. It is really is a waste of money and time. Every review that I read about online dating is a bad one. The whole industry is sickening; praying on the people that yearn to love and be happy only to let them down. Happy holidays !

In one state in Australia where I live I've found it even more difficult to meet a good, down-to-earth woman online. I don't put women on pedestal, had my fair share of relatioships but I"m also shy and busy so i'd really like to see some online dating work. I'm in no rush, but why can't I just find a healthy smart woman who is NOT self-obsessed, for some good online conversation??

At least most guys get some kind of comment. I was on four different popular sites in the last few years I got only a wink or very short text and just one. Met only one woman at a car show for two hours then she got a call and had to get going. I'm real shy too but I feel I sent out some really good icebreaker messages, I put a lot of thought into them, to always sound upbeat and funny. But never got any comment, not even a thanks but no thanks, seems like they don't even get them, but the scammers sure answer quick with a too good to be true letter and great pictures. I was married for fourteen years and divorced for eleven. Was her idea for the split, shes remarried a few years I can't even get a date yet. Think she put a curse on me lol. Can't believe so many people jump in bed on the first date, both sexes. It's that kind of life style that hurts so many people,that nobody trust anybody anymore and I can't say that I blame them. Tomorrow's NEW YEARS EVE and I won't have anybody again, that's why I'm sitting here after midnight typing this.

Which I've never done before, maybe this will work, who ever reads this might know of somebody through the grape vine. I know there's good ones out there (I just read some of there letters here.) There's too many bad ones out there in the way of us good one's. I Know this is a little off the wall but I'll give it a shot. If there's any good one's out there please . I'd love to meet you. Sounds a little like Will Smith in,I AM LEGEND, and that's what it's been feeling like. I'm trying something different, by, bypassing all the dating services. Because, really from the comments I've read about all these dating sites. There's a lot of unhappy people out there, wish they'd quit playing games and say what they really think, that's what I try to do. Thanks for listening . The Real Deal.

The same pigs have shown up on all of the dating apps I have used. I originally started with plenty of fish, where I met two very good long-term friends, but no romantic chemistry. The majority of the other users were soliciting inappropriate photos and sending them as well. A few mentally unstable messages followed rejections. There are just as many people looking for hook ups on match.com as there are on OkCupid and bumble . Disappointing as to what society has become .

I don't agree entirely with this article..the issue is the women are idiots and don't know how to stick up for themselves online. I use dating sites and am smart using them, as a result I don't get harassed. If the woman is smart and secure of herself instead of making it easy for the man it would make dating for a female easier. A lot of women are Insecure of themselves and a man can sense that, if I get a sexualized message instead of being afraid I just message back and say"you're disgusting best of luck." Act cordial instead of ignoring it, the more calm you are and as you get to know the ways of online dating it gets to be easier..

Just saying an insecure woman who acts fearful is more bound to be harassed on these sites. Be smart ladies! Feel confident!

I've also met and dated plenty of men from free dating sites that are seeking a commitment, don't assume ALL men only want a hookup that's not at all true. More so want Casual stuff but if you spend enough time online you'll meet decent men that want a relationship. I had 2 boyfriends come from OkCupid, there are good ones online too. Keep looking! Don't make yourself vulnerable and easy for the men!

"More so want Casual stuff but if you spend enough time online you'll meet decent men that want a relationship."

Nail very much hit on the head. Online dating for girls that are decent (and offline for that matter) requires work and a combination of common sense, good judgement and patience. Same thing for decent guys going online - it requires work and there are guides out there that go a bit further than the generic "read her profile" advice given here if guys looked hard enough for them and that easily help them stand out.

I think the problem is these days people are more desperate than ever for a quick fix and dismiss new ideas if they don't see sparks flying first go. I saw similar things in college where most my friends got brutally negative, generic and uninformed advice (particularly if parents had no clue about their field) if they hadn't gotten a job within 1 week of graduation.

You cant seriously sitt there and say honestly that women have dating harder than men. I mean seriously, is that honestly what you think ? yourr telling me whos been alone for 36 miserabe years, never had a date, been rejected by everyone all the time forever that you with your phone bulging with numbers who gets asex love and dates on demand that i have it easier ? ive been robbed of any chance of a family because i cant get a date and you say i have it easier, im going die alone with no family because i couldnt get a date and you say i have it easy ? are you really that selfish ? decandes of loanliness, and when i say loanliness i mean NOONE, at all EVER, would finish you, you have no idea of the misery that men have being so alone. You watch as your sanity melts away from the slow burning tourture of loanliness, you would go mad, anyone would. It amazes me how selfish women are, it really does, id love to give you all my pain just for one day sso you would understand the utter hopless misery that men have to face ! you say men arre afraid women will laugh at them, this is incorect men are afraid of beingg alone forever and dying after a miserable loanly life, and the trajic thing is a lot will ! do you know what its like to want a family but not having one because you cant get a date, to watch your frineds happily married when your nearly 40 and never even had a date ? to watch oversexed women with hundreds and hundreds of requests complaining that some of them are wierd and men have it so easy ? do you know how painfull a life of loanliness is ? the burning slow tourture of needing t hold someone and noone being there, noone being there after a bad day, noone to confide in , no one to give you any confidence ? noone to hold, just lying in bed alone for deecade after dacade while women complain that some of their attention is from desperate men and so women have it so hard ? you get love sex relationships on demand, and you still moan and complain and say men have it easier my god, this honestly makes me want to kill myself, whats the point in going on if women think so lowly of loanly men. I hate this life i just want to die. I just cant beleive any woman would sit there and say she has it harder than men. You have no idea what decades of blanket rejections and loanliness would do to you, it would kill you, its true hell.

Yeah obviously easier for women. Men have to work hard even to get validation from girls while women have men blowing up their phones boosting their ego by chasing them.

Guys be happy with even unwanted attention from opposite sex.

Women can't make up their minds because of all their o ptions. While men don't have nearly the same amount of options or experience.

They can get attention and sex easily while guy gets neither easily cuz he has to compete for it.

Competing, chasing and getting rejected can be so discouraging that you question if it's worth it if girls are so narcissistic and dismissive to guys' advances.

Women never deal with rejection the way guys do. They never put themselves in that position and so they are constantly avoiding rejection and receiving positive attention from guys chasing them. They wonder why guys see bitter -_-

And creepy behaviour? Why sex so "creepy?" It's natural to want to have sex. Means guy attracted to you. Take it as a compliment. Why society berate the guy for being a man?!

You put up a pic, put little work into your profile, and yet expect so much from the guys who contact you? You even admit you receive nice messages, but refuse to even acknowledge such guys? Not even a simple thank you back? What does that say about you??

Congrats on the ego stroke, but I'm not taking the bait. Lot of guys of looking for someone to actually date, and you aren't that person. Your advice simply does not apply

I wouldn`t take the online dating thing too personally! Lots of good n bad on it. It`s no better or worse than pubs or clubs anyway. You know there could be a good reason why you haven`t had much luck in the dating scene - honestly, it is because you really are very pretty & guys are too scared to ask you out!! Seriously!! I`m not joking. But alas, I`m too old for you at 47, and I live in Sydney & hate planes!!

I was recently scammed on Match.com. There have been class action suits against Match for portraying themselves with 15 million users when only a million are paid subscribers and the rest contain a lot of scam artists looking to relieve you of your cash. The whole site is a scam in the sense they want to auto renew your subscription which is hard to stop once you sign up. I wonder if any of the people on the site are real at all!

It is and some are, had a bunch of dates on there before I met my girlfriend who we now live together and have a beautiful baby boy with. so I see what your saying and agree that it can be difficult bc online you are a sitting target. Where as in the real world it is harder for men to key in on victims. You just have to be more careful use an extra screening process and not take things so personal knowing it is a numbes game and nothing that is exceptional should be expected or necessarily easy to obtain. Just like life if you want something special sometimes it takes hard work!

I think I'm being scammed. I put a report with the fbi a month ago. I'm waiting for them to respond. I'm keeping him on the hook until I hear from the agency. So they can take over and catch him. I've been asked for money. His company name I have researched. It's a generic website and the addresses I looked up for his offices show no record of his company ever being there. Lease records and such. He has an Enflick voip number, but his last picture looks like a location of what he's stated. I can't find evidence his pictures are reposts of someone else. How do I proceed safely until the authorities arrive?

I am a good looking guy not a model will not say that not arrogant but 5'10 and 165 pounds. Last time l was online dating was about 10 years ago meet my ex wife and the mom of our daughter through lavalife.

This time I find pof a total waste of time I am a gold member but our of couple of dozens ladies I contacted 1 only replied back and she told me you are a really nice man and wish you best of luck but just started to date a man.

I am only 40, leave in greater Vancouver, bc have a good job and rent a 2 bedroom place on my own plus drive a suv.

It seems maybe wrong that the idiot men have flooded the ladies to Mt he point they tune out even great men or that many sadly l suspect accounts on pof now are fake .

Either way l am at the point of giving up and l am sure l was not the first or last normal nice man to reach this point due to no ladies replying back at all.

Dont give up fella, just work harder and lower expectations of how quickly results should come. live your life and don't wait but actively work in your spare time. if it was easy to find the woman of your dreams I'm sure she wouldn't be the woman of your dreams. good luck

I've been doing online dating for only a few months seriously. I've been on OKCupid, Tinder, POF (paid), Zoosk (paid), and a whole bunch of other ones I won't mention because I was so naive I didn't realize what all was out there. YIKES!

Anyway, what I am seeing is a growing disconnect and a lot of people getting disgruntled. I have to admit I was too in the beginning. I think it is because one develops expectations based on statistics instead of reality. I thought, at first, "wow, so many women to see who I really am"! Statistically speaking, I should get a few responses. So I start examining the numbers game and thought I could play a little with it.

First, I ALWAYS read a woman's profile. I want to be strategic about this, right? I try to throw in a little humor if I can, but my first message, if there is something in her profile, ALWAYS contains at least one if not a few references to hers. I write in complete sentences and try to seek ways to spark a conversation. I make no lewd comments whatsoever. I don't even reference anything about looks (except once and that was a weak moment on my part since she her picture affected me that way, plus it was an experiment to see if venturing there yielded anything different).

I also try to not be unrealistic as far as types of women I try to engage. I am 52, 6' 2", a little under 200 lbs, no paunch, somewhat athletic and active, and I feel I am decent looking (but have no idea how to quantify that). After reading about how to write a profile, I feel I've written a strategically thorough yet somewhat concise one. I will say that overall, I am an eclectic type that's hard to describe very thoroughly: artsy, scientific, really into aesthetics, research, languages and cultures, and musical (performance and compositions).

I am personally open to a wide variety of situations, but I feel most women want some kind of commitment. I don't game because I haven't dated in almost thirty years. I had been married for about 27 years and now divorced for a year. So I am not even sure what this "game" they keep talking about really is, although I have an idea. Whatever it is, I would certainly abide by the wishes and expectations of whomever I want to see and date.

Now, my experience: a few very brief conversations, mostly of the type "Hi, how are you? What are you doing?" from women who initiated and not one about my interests or anything in my profile. If I try to go deeper at all, they either disappear or keep repeating themselves (probably catfishers since other things about their profiles make their seeking me unrealistic). Then, I have had a couple go a few sentences longer, but almost all have ended. Unfortunately, one had a legitimate mental disorder from traumatic brain injury. I tried to make this one work, but we just could never connect. One other one is so far away, I am still seeing where it goes. But so far, at best we'll be friends and no dates unless I travel over 2500 miles to another country.

I've sent dozens of messages (not hundreds yet), along with "winks" (do these even work? or do women actually find them silly at best, offensive at the least?), with no response. I am paid on POF so I can see where a ton aren't read. A few read, some read then deleted and some deleted outright. I respect the deleted ones, so I don't even bother. A few of those were probably out of my league anyway (I was too old, or they were way more active or maybe interests didn't match). I had hoped that I would have gotten a little more response out of the others, especially ones who were mutual "meet me" that POF has. But even that didn't garner a response. So then I don't know if sending more messages is expected, tacky, pestering, or what. I feel like I need to based on what some women seem to be saying because mine are probably getting lost in the shuffle and I need to work at keeping myself visible.

So, in my disappointment, I have been researching what is really going on. I've found many posts like this about what women "deal with". And I find it interesting how they have the opposite challenge most of the time. And I was honestly surprised at how jaded they get, but I don't blame them because of all these goofball, creepy, lewd, stalker responses they get.

Now I see a dilemma. The nice guys, of which I consider myself right at the center of (not so nice that I would be boring, but definitely nice enough to be respectful of a woman and her boundaries and that no means no), can't get responses let alone dates. The nice women seem to get nothing but tons of messages to try to wade through. What to do?

I think both sides need to step up our game and realize what is REALLY going on here. Who knows where all the drain and noise is coming from, though we know the sources such as scammers, desperate loser types, stalkers, catfishers, etc. And there doesn't seem to be too much that can be done about limiting that. However, if we are aware of it, we can do things to try to counter it. It also seems that we need to become more strategic and not so bitter about how to approach all of this. I see where a bridge needs to be built here somehow. Any suggestions?

Maybe the nice guys need to be recognized more somehow by getting in kind responses from women. If you get a nice initial message, at least say no thank you and even a brief idea of how good the message was. Us guys get no clue whether we are sending out the right message or not. It would even be nice to get some kind of rating system going like eBay or something. SOMETHING to clue us in whether we are just a little off and need to tune up, or to just forget it. This weird limbo of never knowing if it was the message, the profile, the pictures or if who we messaged is overwhelmed is really tough to deal with. It would also be nice to have women realize that if they are getting decent if not outright nice messages more than once from a guy, that these guys are just trying to stay on top of the crap that that woman is otherwise getting; that they aren't stalking or pestering, they are just wondering if they are getting heard at all.

I don't know what to do about the jerks. I think a lower percentage of guys that are like this are out there. But for some reason these idiots are taking up all of the dating bandwidth. And about the only thing I can see nice guys who really want this to work bringing to the table is to just not get bitter and disappointed. I don't know, it is really hard to see how to break this cycle that is destroying online dating for the majority of us. It would be helpful to know that possibly a new kind etiquette be understood by women that repeat messages that are nice should be acceptable and that we men kindly engage them with these; that we get a chance to overcome the idiots by countering them somehow. Also, maybe people could work up some kind of meta-dating situation (something like responding to websites about online dating or, as I said above, some kind of rating system)?

For me, online dating is about my only hope of meeting anyone. I am not religious nor do I drink, even coffee (it puts me to sleep). I have food allergies and sensitivities. I work online from home. As a result, I don't go to any place of worship, I don't club or do bars, I can't eat at any restaurants, and I don't have a work environment with other people. I actually have very few friends despite my best efforts. I keep running across so many people with involved lives of which I am just not a part including my family. So, online is the only place I can even think about meeting people.

I go for walks in the park, to the library, and around downtown. What also challenges me is that I am fairly introverted. On top of all this being much older, I have not the foggiest idea on how to hit up a conversation with a woman I've never met before. I didn't when I was twenty (I met my former wife through very unusual circumstances involving an acquaintance and what little dating I did then I did all though people I knew). How am I going to do it at over fifty and not seem weird?

Another approach I am trying is to get involved with community events and groups. But once again, very few, if any women attend what I tend to go to, let alone any who are in my age group and meet other modest criteria, none having to do with "looks". For instance, I go to a drum circle (the only one within 30 miles of me). Of available women who show up (a few unavailable do), it is pretty much just one in her 80s along with over twenty guys. Women tend to do things like Zumba, dance, yoga or other exercise classes where if I showed up, it would be creepy since it will be assumed I am there for only one reason. I would love it if I would be accepted as a drummer for belly or tribal dance, but alas, the same creep factor seems to be at play.

Well, I could probably say more, but I hope to start a conversation about what can really be done about this issue (and not just complaining about it). I would really like to overcome the disconnect with what is happening between guys and gals and to renew proper expectations. Otherwise, it will become one of the biggest fails of our technological communications age.

You sound so honest. WOW!! too bad I didn't meet you.

So that implies you met someone else? =_)

So to show men what it's like to be a woman on a dating site you do this:

2. Upload your photo's and fill your profile.

4. Look for the bad ones and write a blog post.

1. Create an account.

2. Upload your photo's and fill your profile.

4. Initiate the conversation with the man, and let him rate you as you like to rate men.

Why do you think some women get bad experiences? Pictures of dicks being sent to them?

It's because you are STARVING men of attention and after having had a life of not getting equal opportunities, all that's left is that.

Not all guys are bad, but not all women are either, and for every man out there sending women messages that women don't want there is a woman out there who thinks she is worth more then men so she doesn't have to give what she takes.

Instead of "shame walling" men I think women should post pictures of HOW IT IS DONE. You've been telling men they are doing it wrong for centuries. How about you step up to the plate then?

I am trying once again with the online dating. I read the response of the recently divorced 62 year old man in Vancouver.

If you haven't been on a date in 27 years, don't be too disappointed if you can't get one right away. As you said, you and your recent ex were introduced. Probably you had mutual acquaintances and got the opportunity to know one another over time.

The only relationships I ever had started this way. Through friends, meeting at a party, seeing the person regularly in my community.

If you don't drink, you can still no to a bar. There are loads of places where people socialize, listen to music, dance. Have a club soda if you don't drink alcohol.

I try to read the on line profiles of the men who send me messages. I am never married with no kids. A recently separated man is not for me. He is not actually single. I dated a man who claimed to have been divorced for many years. He is very involved with his ex wife (mother of his adult son) as she had an accident and is helping to take care of her. The son (30 years old) is a good kid but has a miriad of personal and health problems. He also had a large extended family he spends a lot of time with. This is great, but I was wondering where I fit in. Apparently he is looking for a lover and was VERY forward (practically dove on me) on our first date. I am a slow starter and do not appreciate this type of thing.

On line dating is not so easy for the over 50 set. Also, since I am not divorced, I usually ask the men why they are divorced. Most do not want to talk about it, so that is a non starter for me.

If the person cannot express to me why their marriage did not work out, their are probably a lot of thing they will not be able to express to me.

Just hang in there. Consider yourself lucky for having had a long marriage. If their is a particular reason why your marriage ended, reflect on it honestly so you can communicate it to a new woman who comes into your life. She will probably ask about it.

In the meantime, don't think about all the limitations you express about all the reasons you cannot "go out". You say you go to the park. Ask a woman to meet you there. You don't have to drink coffee. Just buy one for her. Can you go to a museum? If you get to know her better and you like each other, you can cook a meal for her. Take her to a concert, go to a play. There are loads of graduate schools that put on excellent performances of all kinds that are very reasonably priced or free.

How in the world do you expect to meet a woman if you do not move away from your computer screen?

I paid for an eHarmony subscription for a year because I heard such positive reviews about their matchmaking algorithm, but found that many of the guys also had profiles on POF so I didn't see the point in paying anymore. EHarmony was great in that you could only connect with someone with whom you were deemed compatible, but new matches were sent infrequently. POF allows anyone to contact anyone so it is easy to be bombarded with unwanted messages from incompatible suitors, but it's free. My biggest complaint about online dating is the deplorable lack of manners and grammar. I don't believe I have ever received a message containing even one punctuation mark in the two years I've been a member on POF, and the messages can be outright lewd! I've also been the target of a determined fellow more than once, so it really comforted me to read this author experienced the same. I do not engage with users who are disrespectful, have clearly not read my profile, or lack even a basic understanding of spelling and grammar, and I typically delete these unwanted messages. Sometimes I'll receive a second message challenging my lack of response, for example, "ur pic u seem nice but not to nice to reply ur missing the best d*ck if ur life." It can be very discouraging, but it's so hard to meet people these days. If you're reading this, guys, please take the author's advice and actually read our profiles before you randomly solicit us for sex, and for heaven's sake use complete sentences!

For a MAN to be successful on a dating site you need:

- Being able to drive and own a car

- Having a good job with a 'future'

- Be willing to challenge yourself and better yourself

- Smell and look good at all times

I look for men who DONT want children. I have them already, and finding someone who is happy to date a single mum. Yep, good luck!

no, that does not help either, been there, checked it. no response

Must be great being a woman. All that attention. So easy.

Even if getting attention IS easy, does it mean the man is necessarily right for me?

I read the profiles carefully. And if they read mine carefully, they might discover that I am really not right for them.

I get attention from men all the time. And I speak to men all the time.

Finding a special person is not easy for a man or a woman.

Speaking from personal experience, a man who has poor hygiene and no employment or income is not the man for me. He doesn't have to be rich. I will not date a man who asks me to borrow money or cannot pay for a cup of coffee. If he cannot bother to take care of his teeth, shave or put on a clean shirt, what makes him think I would want to get physically close to him?

The truth is, it is not easy for a man or a a woman to find a good partner. Do you know what you are looking for? If it is just "attention", that is easy to find. If is is a long lasting relationship with a suitable partner, that is not so easy for a man or a woman to find.

Get over the idea that you do not get enough "attention".

Personally, I am very allergic to animals. I live in a city and would not date a man with animals. It makes me uncomfortable as I physically cannot tolerate them. I would never ask the man to give up his pet, so when I see a man is an animal lover, I don't respond. It is not that I do not like animals, I just cannot breathe around them.

I had one boyfriend with a dog who kept the animal very clean, his home was spotless (he had a professional housekeeper and dog groomer).

He also did not allow the dog to lie on the furniture or the bed and was very sensitive to the fact that some people are allergic to animals. I was able to date that man. It is really the exception, however. Other men I know with pets like to lounge with them, sleep with them, have them hang out everywhere. That's absolutely great, but it does not match up with me. So I do not reply.

Think about all the reasons a woman might not reply. Do you live 100 miles away? Are you spending all your time and money on your children from your previous marriage? Nothing wrong with being a responsible parent, but where does that leave the single woman with no kids you want to date? If she is also divorced with school aged kids, maybe it's a possible match.

Women do not "have it easy". And neither do the men.

As a man who has NEVER had a date from the 3 (main) sites I have used, I can categorically say that; even if you read a profile, send a nice message and be pretty much, charming. Us "men" get ignored or blocked. I have been blocked many times for just being interested about a lady's profile. I don't say anything sexual and I am always polite. I will be honest and say that women are just BORED. They want someone to chat to and, when they get bored, there's always 100 more men to choose from. Women will get around 100 messages every few days. They may be crappy messages but it's still a message. I left a dating site for a MONTH and got 3 profile views. No messages. All I see woman say on profiles is how men pester them with sexual comments and, if they are not sexual, all they say is; "hi".

What I wouldn't GIVE for a woman to say; "hi" to me. Some get all the luck!

As a man who has NEVER had a date from the 3 (main) sites I have used, I can catagorically say that; even if you read a profile, send a nice message and be pretty much, charming. Us "men" get ignored or blocked. I have been blocked many times for just being interested about a lady's profile. I don't say anything sexual and I am always polite. I will be honest and say that women are just BORED. They want someone to chat to and, when they get bored, there's always 100 more men to choose from. Women will get around 100 messages every few days. They may be crappy messages but it's still a message. I left a dating site for a MONTH and got 3 profile views. No messages. All I see woman say on profiles is how men pester them with sexual comments and, if they are not sexual, all they say is; "hi".

What I wouldn't GIVE for a woman to say; "hi" to me. Some get all the luck!

Really! I am a woman and just gave up on POF and Eharmony because I did not receive 1 message in the whole 6 months I paid to be on both sites. That's right! Not one message. Not lewd, poorly written or otherwise. So I don't' see how it is harder for a man who can message anyone he likes, than it is to sit and wait and get nothing. Even "unattractive" men get more attention than that. But if you are an average or worse looking female, you might as well not even sign up.

Maybe instead of waiting for a man to contact you why don't you try contacting them.

"Even unattractive men get more attention than that." No, no they doffer not, if you are a guy and you aren't at least a good 7 low 8, aren't just a incredibly interesting person or apparently well off, you wI'll never get a first message until it's a scam or bot, even if you read profiles and send out well thought out, grammatically correct messages. You would be lucky to get get a reply. And as far as average women, let me tell you I'm not one to judge but I know women who by most standards would be considered below average. Guess what? She typically has +50 unread message at any given time. She has showed me. the problem is, is that is so hard to sort though all of them. And secondly it's hard not to get a bit of any ego or get pick when you feel you have the power of choice. Lastly unattractive men do not get a response period. They either get laughed at, get turned into a joke, or have woman block them or threaten them simply for showing interest even if they did so in a completely normal, acceptable way. I'm not saying whether you had it hard or not. But if you think any mean who isn't on the higher side of average is realistically getting any attention you have alot to learn about the male side of this. Also why can't you intimate a conversation? All those men you talk about, probably sent out 10-20+ messages for every single reply they got, you sit around waiting for people to contact you, and claim you have it harder then those who actively contact others just to be ignored or rejected?

I'm female and I've been on Match on and off 3 times. First when I was 50 and looked 45. Then 55 and looked 50, etc. I look great and younger. I had pretty much nothing but weirdos asking for pics naked before we met (really?), 20 somethings looking to learn new tricks, men who showed up for a first meeting looking nothing like their photos (do you really expect to pull that off?), or worse, men who refuse to believe that my pic is really me at my age. when I can pull off a bikini and look great at 53, have a body better than alot of 35 year olds, and am quite sane with no kids at home, I have to wonder, where are all the men in my age group who are divorced and widowed? Out of all this, I had a few coffees and drinks (I won't go to dinner with someone that I haven't met, as I don't want to waste their money or mine if we don't click a bit, so it's coffee or drinks at first) out of many responses, I had no one go out with me that I responded to, I had 2 crazy men I ended up leaving the date after they got weird, and only 1 man who I am still friends with 5 years later. We never became romantic as there was no spark, but we hit it off as friends, something I wasn't looking for, really, but, I figured, oh, well, a single woman can always use a guy friend, and we help each other out with chores. He helps me with yard work and woodworking, I help him with laundry and ironing. Not often, but from time to time we hang out. I don't think its possible for someone in my age group to suceed on line. Too bad.

To women who think that men that get no responses on dating sites are genetic losers or something, you couldnt be more wrong. I get a lot of attention from women outside, im 6 foot 2 and confident and women respond a lot to it. I also look better in real life than on a selfie, id need a professional photographer almost to make me look how I look at myself in the mirror(thats what others see anyway).

On tinder for example I get like 2% matches. If those same women saw me in real life id get at least 75% of the women im interested in, which would mean almost 98%(if they were all single and looking). I've seen similar guys as me, popular guys that try tinder and get zilch. Is it our fault for not wanting to work more on our profiles and hire professional photographers? Anyway I find anyone who spends more than 2 hours on an internet profile is wasting their time. I'll just stick to real life, where women show a lot more judgement.

I am 6 foot and confident and well dressed. I have a job and I am reasonably good looking. I get NOWHERE with women.

These 2 gentleman are correct. There is no point to it anymore. It's a losing game and it's only getting worse. As a decent (not male model) to good looking guy you can get attention on these sites but you will have to get it from someone who is unattractive to you, heavier than you'd like, and/or has kids. That's it. Period. We aren't trying to bat out of our league either, it just is what it is. Online dating is dying and women killed it.

This is my situation. My online profile gets less attention than my real life presence. I'm a bit ticked. I currently have 3 women I work with (that I'm not really interested in at all) totally keep giving me the "I want you look". I don't like going to bars because I'm not much of a public social drinker, and I abhor 1 night stands with people I don't know very well. I'm not very tall (5'11") and apparently good looking enough to always attract attention from someone at least once a month.

I've had way more success than most men on dating sites. Most of the women I've met just want casual sex, typically one night stands. My last two girlfriends from POF were abusive and one pretended to be pregnant. Most women I've chatted to without meeting just wanted an ego boost or to talk to "friends" (on a dating site!). Any woman is going to get a ton more genuine guys than a man will get genuine women. It's a numbers game and the numbers will always favour the girls. Let's hear about how terrible it is for women.

Nick,message me. u seem sweet.plenty of fish. my name on pof..damngirl.

Ok lil boys and girls, heres what they dont tell you and why you do or dont get replies based on your gender. In the 40-50 age groups ..

Most of them are either married, have a boyfriend, or are looking for a relationship/status uprade or just a plain old fashion ego boost. now thoose that arent in this category are far and few between, I personally know a half dozen women who are married and or have boyfriends that have profiles up claiming to be single,, bottom line 90% are fakes .

Now guys for the most part my brethren are the same except where as the women imply theyre single, you retards take off your wedding rings and replace them with credit cards, because all your looking for is a piece if strange and an ego boost cause you knocked up your ol'ladies and no one told you after she pops out a few lil ones her tits are gonna sag and her ass is gonna get wider than broad st, so you think your entitled to go out and chase young strange until you get caught, then you whine like the bitches you are when you do , and dont wanna give up the old and busted til you have the new hotness commited , basically just like all the women do .

So the bottom line here is you have 90% liars of both sexes on these dating sites, the easiest way to weed out the bs is by saying hi how are you, if they respond, great , if not move on,, bitches pic'd infront of a G5, Maz, million dollar yacht are always a give away as a fake and so are all these 40 - 50 something bikini hard bodies. theyre either ancient pics or bitches trying to trade on their looks, either way they're not quality, theyre just skanks

Dating sites are a waste. I've spent two years and read a lot of columns like this (and put the advice into practice). I've had 6 dates, none of which panned out.

I'm a decent guy; solid career, clean background (my job requires security clearance), I'm NOT looking for a hookup, I always try to start conversations with their interests, and I even got female friends to vet my profile.

Yet while I make it clear I'm looking for a serious relationship, I get hit with "oh, I am just looking for a friend, not dating". I get to the point of meeting in person. they don't show, then disappear online. Had several who suddenly realize they are not ready to date again (I'm 47, most singles my age are divorced).

I'll message women who share many interests, who the sites say are 90% or more compatible, and never get even a "no thanks".

I've reached out to around 200 plus women, gotten responses maybe 10% or less, and actually met 6 in person.

What I've found is the old stereotype is often true; if a guy isn't really hot or really wealthy, there's no interest. One who I went on a date with actually said I was too nice. One asked me to text a picture (I have several in my profile, both headshot and full head-to-toe photos), then literally said "oh. you kinda looked better online" and disappeared.

I did the "fake profile" test, left most details the same. Changed my name put up photos of a relatively unknown (in the U.S.) celebrity who is regarded as very attractive to women. The rest of the details (job, interests, kids, etc.) were exactly the same. I not only was flooded with messages, several were the SAME women who had not given the "real me" even a reply.

So my conclusion. online dating it great if you're model/movie star attractive. Otherwise, you're going to spend a lot of time staring at your keyboard.

Robert, you left one factor out. What would you rate your physical attractiveness on a scale from 1-10?

A 6, maybe. And looks are all that counts, I suppose.

I'd also ask what was the attractiveness of the women you were messaging? For most people in online dating (except for the top 1-2% in attractiveness) it's always best to shoot for two or more levels less in attractiveness than you are. If you feel you're a 6, you should be messaging 4s or less.

I have spent 6 years on these sites and had ZERO dates.

I'm a man, and I just started using a dating site to see if I could meet someone. It was kind of an accident that I found myself on OKcupid, but I was recently single after many years and figured wth. Initially I had good success meeting women, and had a few dates. Oddly 2/3 I went out with just wanted to fool around / fwb even though I had put in my profile I was looking for a LTR/possible marriage. Still they were positive experiences and friendly ladies though one seemed offended

My profile was kind of sparse and direct. I read up some about online dating and made my profile more detailed and joined PoF too. after a few weeks I'm not getting any responses to messages I send out. I think I've written decent opening messages, and a few I thought would for sure be interested to talk and then go out as they had indicated a like or some such. Yet it's been 100% fail for like 2-3 weeks. I figured most would be courteous enough to at least respond, even if it's a thanks but no thanks. I always respond when I'm not interested and say why. To me this is just common courtesy. I know many people have different etiquette online then in person and I think that's a bunch of shit. Anyways I can see why some men would get frustrated, and if they express that to you rudely you should be grateful because he just did you a favor showing you that you don't want to date him anyway.

Ladies you have nothing to complain about if in your opinion you're receiving too much attention, even if only a few are quality (that's reality anywhere). It kind of equates to complaining about making too much money. You can't take things personal online and let yourself become jaded and angry. If some jerk sends you dick pics or whatever as his opening line laugh it off and hit your delete button. Honestly it's not like you haven't seen one before, and it's not gonna jump off the screen and bite you lol. Alright I think its time for me to get back to the real world, that fence in my front yard isn't going to paint itself (oh how I wish).

Welcome to reality. You have to paint your fence. Most women on this site paint their own fences too.

Just like you, I do not have eternity to message complete strangers on line.

For your information, dating a man that lives in another city is impossible for me. Simply logistically impossible unless he has loads of dollars. Why? Because I cannot afford to take time and money from work to run after some man 50

Guys - are you reading the profiles and does the woman seem to have anything in common with you?

Is she allergic to animals?

I find the more details I put in my profile, the fewer messages I receive.

That's fine by me because I do not want to have to reply to every guy who lives in a geographical location I have no way to get to.

You would be amazed at the number of men who message me who are not accessible. They live to far away. How can I get to know them if I need to travel over an hour to meet them for a cup of coffee?

Really guys - check it out before you think - hey, no one sent me a message.

There are loads of guys out there - handsome with good jobs that live near me - who love their dog. I NEVER send them a message. Why? Because I am allergic to dogs and I would not expect the person to give up their pet for me.

Other guys, handsome, nice property, etc. live over 2 hours away. How will I date him? Spend a whole day on a road trip to have a cup of coffee with him? Then what? Think about it.

It is sort of flattering to receive a message. But it leaves me with a sinking feeling too - this guy is NOT anywhere near me. He has no means to make it easy for us to get together.

I met someone on OkCupid. We dated for five months within those five months he gained my trust and ended up stealing over $20,000 worth of jewelry watches emptied out my kids but Eubanks. I don't think it had anything to do with the website OkCupid just know that there are bad people out there and always go with your gut feeling he is currently in jail serving time for grand theft and fraud. I think all these dating sites should have some type of background check or a place for you can check people out. I did Google this person and nothing came up. If it's too good to be true it is

I'm a male and must say, you have a damn good point about bgc's. Then again, if I may add, if only dating sites would show all the different profiles users have replied to in the past to get an idea what they're REALLY looking for, yuh know?

Update: even after I mentioned that I wouldn't be able to meet him as I was taking my mom (who is older) somewhere, he proceeds to say I should bring her along. Then calls to ask where we're meeting.

I'm going back to the traditional way of meeting, so you can assess some of the chemistry right off. There's a bit less of the weirdness of online and encountering guys that you know you're not compatible with.

Some guys judge based on women not being interested or giving them a chance. Attraction, chemistry and compatibility is a two-way street and some guys assume it should be one sided when they're interested in you.

For the ladies in similar circumstances of being stuck in the south, look at the contrast of the men in the north to the. guys in nc. Night and day, by that I mean nc is low on decent, educated, articulate legally single men that don't have a few illegitimate kids. Night and day. I miss the north, just based on that. The guys down here scare me.

I see so many women that have lessened and lowered their standards so much that they're broke down and look it. Just no. They will allow the low lifes to leech off of them and to just use them up. No thanks.

These articles written by women on online dating are always cynically amusing to me. You get so many messages, and some of them are crude and offend you. Or, you get to go on a date and the guy is a jerk and offends you and it doesn't work out.

Try being a guy. Try being a guy who is not in the top 10% of looks, occupations, or busy trendy cities. Try receiving NO replies from anyone you message EVER. Try getting maybe one or two messages a month that are either from spambots or women ten years older than you that weigh more than you.

One of the hidden powers of the internet is that it can collect information as well as display it. The vast majority of men on these sites are not good enough for the desires of the vast majority of women, and despite "equality," men are expected to do the work, all of it. Many, many good men see that they are ignored by girls who are still looking for the hunks, and they check out. Some are still there, and will catch these women when "they're ready to settle down," but most will be too bitter and too wise to settle for a former party girl.

Women say the worst thing that can happen is to be raped, but I don't think that is true. I think the worst thing that can happen is to never be desired by anyone for your entire life. You narcissists need to own the society you made by your own efforts.

I would love to see what you look like, as well as your height. Natural selection must clearly be at play in your failed attempts to get womens' interest and it is obviously irking you into misogyny. Sorry for your bad genetic luck.

I am 6'2 , decent tone, good shape, decent job and my own car. My flaw, I am a nice guy.

Treat women with respect and a side of smartass. Shows you have a sense of humor.

True man, women HATE nice men but proclaim to be seeking a "nice guy". I am nice with no car and a crappy job. So I am s**t out there.

First you say: Try getting maybe one or two messages a month. from women ten years older than you that weigh more than you.

Then you say: Try receiving NO replies from anyone you message EVER. the worst thing that can happen is to never be desired by anyone for your entire life. Try receiving NO replies from anyone you message EVER.

People desire you. You receive messages. There are women who want to get to know you, talk to you, go out on a date with you, talk to you on the phone, see if you're a good man they want to have in your life. You're just too stuck up to get to know them because you think you "deserve better."

Stop complaining. You receive messages. There are women interested in you. Get off your high horse and your pedestal, stop being so stuck up about physicality and age and talk to the nice women who took time to message you. You know. like you're complaining about the women who don't respond to you.

its funny how guys who message women 10 years younger are creeps, and women complain because some of their mesages are from older men, yet when a man gets a message from a woman 10 years older than him he shoul dbe gratefull and dont be so rude to her, she is nice and you should go out with her. Interesting that isnt it, why should he be gratefull yet women be offended ? come on lets stop pretending here women have it waaaaaaaaaaay easier than men, just for one in your life admit it, you wownt ! but it would be nice !

A cousin was dating a 29 year old when he was 19. My sisters all called her a perv to her face. Stop being so bitter that you splice and dice reality. Going online moaning might not sound like it affects dating but it does. Women can tell guys that moan about this apart from guys that have respect and other guys won't like you. On the Viber group I'm on (all male) all the guys are fed up with guys that rabbit on about 'friendzone' and other imaginary concepts and won't be friend with guys like that. Overall you just shoot yourself in the foot with this bull crap.

Mate, the above article is actually understating some of the abuse women receive. One friend got tons of downright judgemental messages on one site for putting up a photo of her at a party on the basis of it "not being respectable". Another got a torrent of abuse from one guy on Tinder as she wouldn't respond to the ever innovative 'hi' failing to understand that matching doesn't mean he owns her. Whenever I meet someone online I worry about scams - female friends have to worry about that PLUS where is safe to meet. It's all too common even offline - I was at a social event years ago where a guy threw a punch at a woman as she wouldn't sleep with him and I could hear him rant about how he had "earnt it" by chatting her up, and only for a female friend holding his arm he didn't connect. But I'm sure it's just cynically amusing for me to go on about sexual aggression any more.

To be fair the above advice on reading profile etc etc isn't exactly going to create a breakthrough. Google "Tolani Osan online dating first messages to reel them in" and read Tolani's article. Until I found this I never had a message reply. I was totally unconvinced but it worked practically instantly. I took a look at a female friend's inbox once and all it was was a collection of "hi" and boring messages. One quite similar to the messages in the article stood out. I jokingly suggested she try that one - she already had responded. Internet dating isn't perfect but this may change your perspective.

But also stop being so shallow - even if that supermodel wanted you, as soon as she sees that you moan about older women she won't want anything to do with you - this is always evident eventually from talking to someone when they are with friends. I've seen this bitching at parties or when out - for some reason whenever I'm not single they hide in their room, but then as soon as I break up with someone they converge on me patronisingly telling me I'm too nice (as if I've never heard that nonsense before) and too this that and the other and using aggressive hand gestures in lieu of actual arguments or points to back their cause. It always ends the same way with that tool going home alone to have a wank while the host agrees to never invite them again, and in one case it worked in my favour once in a nite club as a conversation starter where I wound up taking home the girl he was trying to get with. Try not being that guy or at least if you are not, try not coming across that way.

Wow! A woman 10 years older than you? How shocking and sexist!

I have not dated an older man in years. None of them can keep up with me.

Why is it reasonable for a man to prefer a younger woman and not reasonable for a woman to prefer a younger man?

This is one of the funniest comments on this thread.

I didn't mention this based on my latest from pof. The guy lives in a rural town about an hour and 20 minutes away. He and I have only been talking for about a week.

He wanted to do Starbucks. I'm not a coffee drinker and I'm finding out a lot of people actually hate doing meetup via Starbucks. They've said they felt like they were on a job interview and I agree. I've gone with a date (not someone from pof), but it was the first date, prior to Starbucks everything felt okay, but thereafter he was firing off questions interview-style.

Back to this last guy, he seems okay, kind of formal, but that's fine. So initially he suggested Starbucks, so I'm thinking he wanted to do a meetup, which I don't really do as I'm not seeking quantity or talk to a bunch of guys down here and engage in the whole meet and greet thing.

So then he suggests that I drive to a desolate town where my cellphone coverage is sketchy and we could find something there. I say no due to:

2. Having sketchy phone coverage there.

3. Driving over 30 minutes for me to meet him just didn't feel ideal.

4. Not having any set agreed upon location.

5. It's the south, I don't trust going strange out of way places that I'm not sure of.

So after that he suggested I drive an hour and 20 minutes to the closest city and we go out. I thought about it and to be honest being that I'm not sold on him, a date isn't going to sell me on him, if I'm already unsure about him. That date was scheduled for today. I let him know yesterday that I wouldn't be able to go.

I think I want to go back to traditional dating and the chance of meeting someone. I feel like attractive women have to be so defensive online that you truly can't be yourself and then you encounter so many angry, bitter guys that are lashing out if there is no mutual reciprocity. Not to mention those that will create another profile to continue to try to harass you. The married or involved guys that assume that every women should be at their disposal. No thanks.

Even when you preface that you are seeking friendship initially, guys don't care. So if any lady is considering, think twice, but be prepared to put up with a lot of bs compiled with weeding through a ton of oddballs. Also be careful, if anything seems off or the guy seems pushy, listen to your gut.

I think I'm giving up on online faking/dating. It by far has been the worst experience since I've relocated to the south. I live in a small town, so I listed the next larger city, which is about an hour away.

The main reason why as this is a small town comprised of many seeking sexual hookups, it's a military town which equates to a college town, most singles are seeking quantity not quality.

I've tried pof and blackpeoplemeet, even though my experiences on pof have not been great. Ladies, steer clear of blackpeoplemeet, the men are of very, very, very poor quality, lowest caliber of men (at least in the south), think in terms of tugged out, older, unkempt, dirty looking, overly aggressive/stalker types with a huge sense of over entitlement. I wouldn't use that site for free.

My experiences with pof haven't been great, but not as horrific as bpm. I did encounter two stalker types, but it was when I first joined and listed my profile in the small town that I'm in. Both guys seemed to have some sort of mental instability, the first being the worst and a potential Ike Turner waiting to happen. Met him once and during the date he seemed okay, a bit shy at first, but he started to open up. By the end of the date he asked me out again for that weekend and I accepted.

That evening I got home from meeting him, I text him that I'm home and thank him for a nice evening. I go to shower before bed and he calls while I'm in the shower, then he texts that he called. He did that a few more times. I noticed when I looked at my phone and text him back that I'm going to bed, that it's getting late.

The next day while I'm at work, he calls and texts while I'm away from my phone. Although I text some, I'm not one that wants to live with my phone attached to me at all times and work does not permit personal cell phone use over productivity. So he calls and texts a few more times. When I get a break I responded that I'm at work and cannot talk to which he replies that he'd prefer that I always answer his calls.

I don't respond anymore until I leave work. He continued to text some more during the course of that day. When I got home I looked at all of the texts and my first thought was "he's crazy" and he's showing me that he's controlling, so I proceeded to let him know that he and I were not compatible. I wished him luck in meeting his compatible half and he proceeded to call and text until about midnight.

Long story short, women have a harder time if you're seeking compatibility and chemistry. I f you're not open to sexual hookups and you preface it, you'll probably be scrutinized and even get some hateful responses. Online faking/dating is not a place to be yourself within your profile, because most can't tolerate realness, especially if they fall under your level of compatibility.

I've tried a few dating sites such as: plenty of fish, zoosk and lavalife.

Lava life was an awful experience for me. I'm a 21 year old woman and I had countless older men (45+) ask if I was interested in being their 'sugar baby' (aka pay me to sleep with them). I not only found that offensive, but it was also scary to think about the amount of men out there that only care about having sex. And a lot of these men said they were married on their profiles. After having absolutely no luck and not finding a single guy I was interested in, I deleted my account.

I then tried zoosk. I thought that maybe if I paid to date online that I would find guys that were serious about dating and having a relationship. This was much to my dismay as well. I talked to one decent guy while I was on that website and we couldn't ever meet because he lived in Quebec and I'm in Ontario. I got fed up with paying for basically nothing and deactivated my account.

After this disappointment, I gave up on dating entirely for quite some time. I thought the right guy will come along when he's supposed to. However, months went on of nothing and I decided to give plenty of fish a try. I must say that there are definitely more men closer to my age on this site and while there are a few douches, there seem to be some really nice and decent guys on here.

Watch out for the typical douche that's in his mid-late 20's and his pics are all of him at the gym flexing. These guys will typically ask if you're interested in being their submissive sex slave wherein they 'own' you. They're arrogant and seem to be surface level. I hate stereotypes and I'm sure there are decent guys with these kinds of profiles but I have yet to see it. In addition to that, there are guys who seem to be possessive and get offended when you don't respond to them. (Word of advice guys, getting mad at a woman for not being interested or responding to you will not help your case whatsoever.) And you need to understand that us women get more than 50 messages a day, we can respond and be genuinely interested in each and every one of you, we would lose track of our conversations. The bottom line is that the right woman will respond to you someday and you'll just have to be patient with us because we also have anxiety about online dating. It's scary to think about meeting a man that you've never seen in person before. We can be very apprehensive about who we choose to respond to for this reason. And that's not to say that we all have a preconceived notion that all men are out to hurt us because that's not the case, but it's definitely food for thought before going out on that first date. You must understand that it's a two way street and just because you message someone, doesn't mean that we're obligated to respond. Also, for all the women reading this, if you come across a man's profile that you like, you can always start a conversation with them too if you're so inclined!

As for the nice guys, they will take the time to read your profile and message you about a common interest you have. Or they will ask questions about you and genuinely try to get to know you. They should have manners and compliment you in a gentlemanly way, not in a perverse manner. I'm actually supposed to meet someone this week and I feel quite confident in saying that he's one of the good ones on plenty of fish.

Obviously I think it's obvious which dating website I would recommend, and that would be plenty of fish for sure. There seems to me more options for everyone! And while there are some men who are not genuine, it's fairly easy to weed out the good from the bad.

The only real question here is: If there's so many bad messages, why are the good ones ignored? I've been on ten dating sites in 3 years and I'm still looking. You want to talk about not enough time to read messages? Try having to write them. After so long I got tired of trying to be original and became a human spam bot. It's a lot of work for either gender but ladies don't insult me. You're going to have to wade through messages either way. You're going to have to put in some effort. You could try messaging a guy first. It'd sure as hell make my day.

There may be something in your profile the women read and do not like. You may be younger or older than their preferred age preferences. They may not find you attractive. You may write the best message in the world. but if you are not their type, you're simply not their type. Nothing you can do about that.

Don't think women don't go through this too. Unless you're in the top 1-2% in looks or in their 20s, if a woman writes a man, she will get ignored too. Those that don't ignore us are just looking for sex.. It isn't a competition. It sucks for both genders. And, let's not even talk about how bad Black women and Asian guys have it. If any people have the right to complain about online dating, it's them because, from what I've read, it's truly awful for them.

Wow. Kay - you said it. I'm mixed race: African-American, French, Polynesian. Average height, thin, graduate degree, bilingual, gainfully employed and make well over 100k, late 30s, I have older brothers so don't take myself too seriously. I'm told often that I'm beautiful. But I haven't been on a date in years. I tried online dating and it was the oddest experience. Lots of old, not older, but just old white men; a fair amount of young white men/boys around 26/27, which I'm not attracted to, a few from Black guys, but again, way older. Crickets from guys 34 - 47 black or white. Apparently I make for a good fantasy but not relationship material. Go figure. So I'll just focus on my career and hobbies.

I have been divorced for almost 15 years and have used various websites for dating including free ones such as POF n OkCupid and match and most recently zoosk. I am 43 years old and I'm looking for something serious. I have made what I'm looking for known clearly from the start. I'm also not a bad looking lady who has a professional office job and and no larger than a size 8. I usually date men who are a few years younger than me or a few years older than me and from what I can find at this stage is that the men are using online sites as if the women were hookers. They no longer seem to have respect for women they tell lies they lead you on by saying that they too are looking for something long term to only leave after a few weeks or a month and a half that's all I can seem to find out there and I have been looking for years now.

My most recent experience on zoosk I met a police officer who yes I know they can be bad just as anyone else and this one by far was the worst.

I verified that he was in fact a police officer because he works in a nearby town and everything is public information online anyway. The first night we went out he did spend quite a bit of money as we met for drinks and then had dinner and then saw live music at the same venue. We kissed that night and talked the next day and decided to set up a second date for less than a week later at which point he said that he couldn't be spending so much money and that if I felt comfortable I could go to his house and he would cook me dinner.

Since he is a police officer and I was able to verify that I agreed and we had a lovely time together and there was some play although not full blown sexual relations and I thought everything went greatly.

the next day he was acting differently than he had been acting the past 8 days or so by not being as responsive and not seeking me out. So when we texted I had accused him of being on a date and I told him that I did not appreciate the f'ing games. The next night was supposed to be our third date and when I texted him to tell him what time he could come over he said he had thought about our conversation and that it wasn't going to work so here I am sitting in my car by myself on what would have been our third date writing to all who are out there in an attempt to get this heartache off of my shoulders because I feel that everything went great and did I use a bad word? sure but do people argue? of course they do. and other than that I didn't think there was anything that wouldn't lead up to another date certainly not for him to just say it wasn't going to work at all.

I have many more stories but don't have the time to post I hope this helps some women out in knowing that there's a lot of good women out there and the men are just treating us like garbage and something has to stop I am ready to abandon my online dating account because it just isn't worth it to me to get used like an old rag especially when I am NOT looking for anything casual even though I enjoy sex as much as the next person does.

Agree 100% Women, try putting yourself in men's shoes.

Very good article. It is very tough for us men too. I didn't enjoy online dating at all I found it very shallow. We don't like the thought of people judging us on a photo and then we start doing it ourselves.

All the paid sites mentioned are full of creeps too. Actually the guys on the free sites are on the paid ones too. Also, the paid sites scam people by auto billing when they were instructed not to. If I'm going to be lied to I'll stay on the free sites. Why pay for the nonsense!

To anyone considering paying for match.com, I strongly suggest you first perform a google search for: consumeralerts match.com

That is odd I have been on okcupid for over 3 years and I have yet to find a gf off it. I am 37 years old, single never married no children, looking for a serious relationship that ends in marriage. However I have yet to find that. I have had one date while I was in the USA and she was Peruvian. I met a few girls when I was in Brazil, Chile, and Peru. Now I am in the Philippines and still not getting much luck. Every woman I meet just wants friends. When women say they all men want is sex I laugh at that. If I just wanted sex I would hire an escort or a bargirl for a few hours.

The problem with these men being dicks is that this works. It sucks. It is annoying. But it gets them results and, in my male opinion, it gets them further than men who are gentlemanly. i know this through personal experience (i've had an OKC and a POF off and on for an embarrassing amount of years and have been mildly unsuccessful) and through person anecdotes (i have known guys who are these type of people and it works for them and it is why they do it). Send enough messages out like these, and at least one of them is bound to bring you results.

A second problem is the amount of fake female profiles. This is mostly on phone apps like Kik and Tinder. It seems to me that over 95% of profiles are fake. They message you as though they are looking to hook-up but then they just want you to join a website. i think this gives a further impression to assholes that this is how you should be using these apps(?); like a dick. That may be a stretch, i don't know.

Third. When a female does message me, they will usually start with the usual "hi" and "how are you?", but that is the extent of it. Every response after that are short one-word answers, never a question, that do nothing to advance the conversation. One male that i know told me it is because "their real intention is to hook-up but they don't want to sound like a slut so you need to engage." I can't agree with this, but at the same time. i don't have a better answer for why this happens so much.

This all really sucks because the very rare times i do get the balls to message someone (i rarely do and the explanation for this is coming up), the female is immediately on defensive and quick to judge. You know right away that all she gets are men demanding that they send dick pics. The one great quality that i have going for me is my sense of humor. i know i am funny. everyone around me knows that i am funny. But, my jokes often get a reaction as though i offended in some way.

Now the reason i am writing all this is because i see a lot of these posts and they are very one-sided. i am not excusing men at all and i completely agree that they are douchers, but no one is examining the other side and why exactly this may be (other than some twisted sense of privilege). There are a lot of non-assholes out there, but they are not getting anywhere and there are a lot of nice women out there who are getting somewhere, but not at all what they wanted (if that makes sense).

I thought it was just me! Women do indeed send a hi and then go into defence mode. Gets me every time! So damn stupid.

Hey Taylor, I have found that even on the paid sites, the majority of MEN are just looking for sex only. I have been on Plenty of Fish, OK Cupid (I actually call it OK Stupid) Zoosk, Our Time.com, Paranormal.com, & eHarmony, & Match. I would agree that eHarmony would have the most authentic men that are genuinely looking for a relationship, not just a hookup. However, I have mostly encountered married men (pretending to be single), scammers, con-artists, identity thieves, & players. I think the world has gone to hell and all the "decent men" were from the WWII generation and they have died off! It's very sad what is out there.

You mean most of the good men. It stinks though when the few good men out there are not given a chance, sure I realize that maybe men might have to do something to spark an attraction, but do you also realize that there are men that say the same about women? Where are all the good women?? It's hard to find them. A lot of women say that, "where are the good men" when they are not good women themselves. It's hard to know if it's because they aren't good women or its because men aren't given a chance, it maybe just because they aren't good women in the first place. It is a sad world out there, agree

Nice refreshing advice here - I got set up with someone - my friend had just started seeing his brother, and so after a couple of days texting each other, I suggested next time I saw my friend, the four of us meet up. His response? "Actually that would make me feel very uncomfortable. I wouldn't want my brother there. It should just be about me and you." (we've been texting for a day!) "I don't need a prop [laughing]." So I said I'd feel more comfortable in a group meeting for the first time, with someone I know there, but that he could come to my city (about 2 hrs) to meet if that's what he wanted to do. He suggested two cities I've never been to half way, and where I don't have friends, and then finally sent me a recorded message: "You're wrong, it's not better to meet up in a group, my brother thinks you're wrong too. In fact we both forbid that to ever happen honey. When we've been dating for a while then we can maybe meet with other people" Although he wasn't obscene or anything like some of these comments, for me it's about someone respecting you and your boundaries and choices. At that point I realised my instincts were right !! Stranger Danger ;) (and never forbid a woman to do anything!!)

Such an idiotic thing to offer. a date is between two people. If you need a crowd, go to a bar.

Yea, as a non-weirdo guy.. that's very weird. Especially if it's with his own brother, depending on the dynamics of their relationship.

You say what about i should talk so i dont tell lie i need a port to tell her few sentences after a year.waiting uf here is not ok .ok i say byby.

I hope i dont send these 2comments to her.so her message should be heavy of complains which nobody cant do but instead of it kill her.17 years life i did not touch @ny female reasone loyalty and loved her.thats a great pain ilet him lives alive. You dont know what she took my reputation.if i say you will cry.

Fantastic article, Taylor! So sad to see a couple of ridiculous comments on this post, but I'm sure it's pretty obvious these people have nothing better to do with their time than write nonsensical comments. Keep up the good work! :)

This is ineresting. Its more difficult for older women. some men are still tring to act like teenagers. And yes I have seen more than my share of men with an erect penis trying to impress me. Finally, I have just given up on online dating for awhile. I started to get angry about the way men treat women online. I beieva I am a good person and unfortunately some great man will never know because he' afraid to take a chance. And there are scammers on all the sites. I've run across them on every site I have been on.

Thank you for writing this article, Taylor—it's a very interesting look into a side of online dating that a lot of men (obviously) don't often see. I think after reading this, if I were to ever use an online dating site, I'd go for Casual Kiss . . . scammers seem like the least of evils in comparison to the other jackasses out there.

I also have to commend you on how you've dealt with a comments section that's filled with all the vitriol that comes along with an article about women's perspectives. While these comments have fueled a sense of misanthropy that commenters have instilled in me lately, I'm very proud to be part of a group of authors at MakeUseOf who are unafraid to put themselves out there and discuss issues that immediately bring out the worst in people (and patiently, gently, and effectively deal with the predictably disgusting responses).

Keep up the great work. Can't wait to see what's coming next!

Thanks Dann, I really appreciate that. And I'm glad you enjoyed the article!

Casual Kiss is definitely cute and probably would be a better site if it were bigger and less scammy, but that's going to happen anywhere.

About Tinder, Personally I think it's a hookups tool at all-_-?sorry?

I'm sorry for making the comment about your picture. It was insensitive and uncalled for.

Thank you. I appreciate the apology, truly.

I have had many bad experiences with online dating, but I was able to find my now boyfriend through it all.

Conversely, I've been on various online dating sites for 14 years and in all that time I've never managed to find even a single date.

I am really disappointed that so many comments here relate to the author's appearance rather than the substance of her article and experiences.

I'm glad you found someone, Rina! It's a shame when someone has to have so many bad experiences for one good one.

Awesome article! That Cracked article is one of my favorites on the site.

The people attacking the author because of her looks are the same assholes wondering why nobody will date them.

Thanks! It's one of my favorites as well. Although I don't know how Ali Reed dealt with soo many negative comments.

Some good suggestions on what to watch out for and how to be respectful online. The sense of pseudonymity that the Internet gives can bring out the worst in some (and not just on dating sites…), but it can also bring out the best in folks who (for a variety of reasons) have a tough time interacting face-to-face. Sifting through the questionable and downright creepy can be time-consuming and depressing, but it can also open up potentially great opportunities.

Exactly. The internet can bring out both the worst and the best in people, but unfortunately the best isn't as loud as the worst. I personally prefer meeting someone online, because you can watch for any potential red flags before you accidentally end up in harms way.

And then I know a lot of people who have met their significant others online and are in thriving relationships. It does happen! :)

she should have responded, because she's not very good-looking.

Your comment is totally off-putting and insulting to Taylor. This adds nothing to the conversation and proves the point made here about how poorly people act online. Clean up your act and don't post a comment if you're just going to attack one of us.

Taylor looks absolutely lovely: very pretty, with bright eyes, and a smiley face. Methinks she's not the one with the problem here, dee.

34 guys wrote and she didn't bother to write back to any of them. proving that even homely chicks like her don't appreciate attention they get on dating web sites.

not cool. seriously. don't attack our writers.

no one has to "appreciate the attention" of others. they don't owe people anything. if you don't want to respond, you don't have to respond.

please keep your comments respectful in the future.

My neighbors got divorced because her husband was cheating with a woman he met on. match.com. They may be good places to find dates, but they're also good places to find adulterers. Sigh.

" they’re also good places to find adulterers."

The guy was going to cheat no matter what. The dating site just made it easier/convenient. If it wasn't online dating site, it would have been on line at the supermarket, or at work, or at the deli.

Also, regarding scammers. I occasionally pay for match.com. The overwhelming majority of profile views (by approximately 10 to 1 margin) that I get are from scam accounts that want to direct me to sex services or are otherwise clearly scam accounts.

And eharmony.com won't even attempt to match some people. It's entirely possible to complete its long profile interview only to be told that its process won't work and therefore it won't even show you other people's profiles.

That's a good point - men face constantly being targeted by sex services (many of which are probably run by women!). so, I guess it isn't only scary men who are ruining dating sites. :-)

A big part of the reason men act out on dating sites is that it is exceedingly difficult to get any attention otherwise, thus creating a situation in which women feel that they have to filter more and more unwanted contact and making it that much more difficult for those who might want to play by the rules.

But if you'd like to know what it's like to be an average straight guy on a dating site, make a profile. Send a several short and well written messages to women and then watch as they never even visit your profile, let alone reply to your messages. It's entirely the opposite problem, but I promise that it's just as demeaning.

Two friends of mine (twin brothers, overweight, in their mid 40's, and really into tattoos and horror movies) have found some success on plenty of fish. They are totally honest and don't use the typical "walks on the beach" and "good book" cliches.

If you're a safe, good man, it's going to shine through in your profile and it will be noticed. It may take some time though.

If I was you, I'd literally lose that picture pronto. Not just on dating sites but everywhere. You look like somebody just stuck a knife in your back.

"telling a woman about what you would like to do to her sexually without any prompting is not a compliment."

Some guys get off on those kind of fantasies. If it came to actually performing any of the acts with a woman, they would freeze. They are all talk and no action.

Some guys think it is funny to be graphic and scaring the crap out of women.

Some guys are misguided and think that is the way to prove their machismo.

Bottom line, as you said, let somebody know where and with whom you are going, meet and stay in a public place, stays sober and don't give out any personal information.

"If I was you, I’d literally lose that picture pronto. Not just on dating sites but everywhere. You look like somebody just stuck a knife in your back."

Attacking someone because of their appearance. Nice. Stay classy, Dragonmouth.

Ah, a night in shining armor riding to the defense of the fair young maiden, ready to slay any straw man on her behalf! Trying to earn enough brownie points to be admited to the Round Table, Sir Matt?

I was commenting on the picture, not the person. The picture is not a flaterring one. Unless, of course, Taylor used that picture on the dating sites as a discouragement. However, she uses the same or similar one at the head of her MUO articles.

If I was you, I'd literally lose that name pronto. Not just on MakeUseOf but everywhere. You sound like a 12 year old still stuck in a weaboo phase.

I really couldn't care less about the reasons why men do it. What I'm saying is don't. Plain and simple. That should be obvious to any decent guy out there, which so many of these same men claim to be.

It's no better or worse than "lalaliebe." :-)

FYI, I've had that handle longer than you've been alive and it has nothing to do with Japan.

Dragonmouth - you are entitled to post your opinion in response to the content of posts (as you do often). Your input across our site has been appreciated. However, personally attacking our authors will not be tolerated. Consider this a final warning.

For the record, I think Taylor's photo is flattering and I would hope she keeps it.

Dragonmouth is just a crotchety old man who thinks he is smarter and wiser than everyone else. Always so willing to remind everyone how they are wrong and he is right in the rudest way possible.

Taylor, don't mind him. Make Use Of, please ban him already.

I’ve had a profile on a very small German site which at the beginning was similar to facebook, although much smaller and more local (just the surrounding towns).

Over the years it turned more and more into a dating site but I left my profile there.

Then one day a girl saw my profile and apparently liked what she saw :)

Three years later we are married have a son and our second child will be born in September.

So… yeah… that worked quite well. Best decision of my life to leaf my profile on said site :D

That's great, congratulations! That sounds interesting, a small, local social network. :)

Most women are very horrible to meet altogether these days since they really want the best of all and will never settle for less because of their greediness and selfishness which is why many of us good men are still single today.

Taylor Bolduc is a technology enthusiast and Communication Studies student hailing from southern California. You can find her on Twitter as @Taylor_Bolduc.

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Why Would a Younger Woman Want to Date a Much Older Man?

Okay, Evan, I agree mostly with your opinion on younger men/older women. What do you say about the reverse? I mean, I can see why an older man would want to date a younger woman – physically that is, but why would a 28-year-old woman want to date a man 45 or more?

I can totally understand why older men go for younger women. There’s no denying that they’re, for the most part, in better shape, with better skin, and less baggage from broken relationships. Time creates wisdom – but it also creates responsibilities and complications – mortgage, kids, career, etc. All of this makes dating more and more complex as we get older. It’s a lot easier for a man to take out a carefree, responsibility free, baggage free, wrinkle free 28-year-old, which is why so many men try to go in that direction. I’m not condoning this. I’m OBSERVING that it happens.

Still, most of them fail miserably, for the exact same reasons that I think Penelope is suggesting. Men want much younger women, but rarely do much younger women want older men. Put another way, if a woman has an array of other quality options closer to her age range, what incentives would she have to date a man who is SEVENTEEN YEARS OLDER?

She doesn’t NEED a guy who’s 45. She can find that same amazing guy at age 30. Or 35. Or 40.

Before any 40+ people get all hot and bothered about this – I am not judging. There is nothing wrong with aging. I do think people improve with age (my wife is nodding). But let’s not pretend that we, as a culture, don’t worship at the altar of youth. If you’re over the age of 40 and have ever said, “But I’m told I look five years younger than my age”, then you’re not immune to it yourself. But see, for men who covet younger women, it’s not whether you look good for your age – it’s what age you really are.

Because it’s competitive out there for all of us. People have choices. And nobody has more choices than a 28-year-old woman. If she wants to date a guy who is 6’2”, makes $400,000+, likes skiing, is within ten miles of her house and five years of her age, you know what? She could probably find him. All she has to do is go on Match.com, and wade through a few thousand applicants. The point is, she doesn’t NEED a guy who’s 45. She can find that same amazing guy at age 30. Or 35. Or 40. She doesn’t need a guy who will be taking Viagra when she’s sexually peaking at 43.

Don’t get me wrong, there are advantages in a 45-year-old guy. He’s probably a man . He’s got the job and the home and the car, and been divorced with a kid already. So if a woman finds it more appealing to just step into that world – to jump from the prolonged adolescence of the late 20’s into full-fledged settled-down womanhood – that could make sense.

Most of them are completely creeped out at the prospect of dating a guy who was alive when JFK was alive.

There are many other things that are attractive about older men. They embody wisdom and stability. They can afford nicer restaurants and vacations and have cultivated greater tastes in the arts. They’re more experienced, more chivalrous, and more likely to want to settle down than a twentysomething party boy.

And yet, they probably resemble Penelope’s dad more than they resemble her brother….

This is the most compelling reason behind why younger women might go for older men: they’re daddy substitutes. An older man’s going to be the strong, nurturing guy who takes care of her, teaches her, and treats her like a princess – the kind of relationship that she probably lacked growing up.

Hey, I’m no psychologist – just your friendly, neighborhood dating coach. But I do know women, and lots of women in their 20’s. And the truth is that most of them are completely creeped out at the prospect of dating a guy who was alive when JFK was alive. These women were born in the EIGHTIES. They grew up with computers. They’re contemporaries with Britney Spears. Whether we like it or not, there is nearly a full generation gap between 28 and 45. A few women may bridge this gap for lust or money or dimestore psychological reasons, but most of the 28-year-old women I know would prefer to date a great, stable 30-40 year-old – who also knows what Snapchat is.

Okay, older men – tell me why I’m wrong. But don’t forget, you and your younger girlfriends are the EXCEPTION. I’m writing about the RULE.

By the way, my girlfriend wants it on record that she would totally sleep with Harrison Ford if he should be reading this. So as a gift to both of them: Sure, why not? Happy 66 th , Indy!

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Comments:

When I was in my late 30’s I became involved with someone 15 yrs. older. The age difference did not seem especially significant during the 5 yrs we were together. Now in my mid 40’s though, the idea of dating someone in their 60’s does seem like a big difference in terms of where we each are in life.

Harrison Ford being an exception for me as well though, I have to say. (He’s really 66? Wow!)

great to hear you feel that way. Helps with my heart ache.

And yes, I agree, Harrison Ford is the exception. :)..

And I think I have come to the conclusion, I rather stick to my age now..when I am 50, I won’t be dating a man in his 30s…but I can now..

MY MARRIAGE CALASP MY HUSTBAND OF 25 YRS STOP MAKING LOVE TO ME WHEN HE WAS 45 NOW HE IS 50 I STILL HAVE NO SEX BUT HE LOOKS AT YOUNGER WOMAN I FEEL LIKE I WASTED MY WHOLE LIFE AWAY ON A OLDER MAN IM 40 HE IS 10 YRS OLDER THAN ME OLDER MEN SUCK AFTER 45 I FEEL THE SEX IS OVER

I am 45 Just got married in June, 1st marriage, My wife is 22 Dated for two years no sex. I was kinda creeped out by age difference. But you, 15 year old baby and you in your 30’s! That’s sick! It took two years to see where her head was, she was 20 at the time. A 15 year old doesn’t know one damn thing about life and you robbed her of that.

you read that wrong…. They’re 30 dating someone 15 years older.. Calm down its ok.

I am 27 engaged to a 48 year old man. I can honestly say that when I first met him, I had no clue that he was his age…I knew he was legal because we worked together. Early to mid 30s yeah, but no one could have made me believe that this man was 46 (when we met that was his age). I love him dearly and he has been the best father to my children, and an even better man to me. 6 months into our relationship I knew that I wanted to spend the rest of my life with this man. My family was very much against him and I dating because of his age but in time they have grown to love and adore him just as much as I do. He told me that I was mature, and that he usually never goes for a woman my age but there was something about me that he wanted. I literally gave a coworker my number and told her that he was going to be mine. Sexually he is everything! My friends joke and ask have we ran out of Viagra yet, I would be horrified at what he would do to me ifnue ever took one of those. Our union is perfect and we have yet to have an issue about our age difference. I love him and would not trade him for anything in the world.

im 25 yrs old .im engaged to my sexy 42 year old guy ,the wedding is in a few months ,I have been with him for 30 months and it has been amazing ,all relationships has its rough times but over all we never quit on each other …I love him As much as he loves me and sexually he is fantastic ,can’t complain . He said to me once – as women we always ask …y ? And he says all “my life never have I met a woman that I can be myself with …never did he once get the feeling he needs to impress me with his money or lifestyle and I am happy…”

Ashley…that was totally sweet! You weren’t looking at age, but the quality of the man you love and your wonderful relationship together. Americans are so uptight about age and dating\relationships. There seems to be such a stigma concerning the latter. I’m currently dating a lady who is 30 and I am 58. This may sound corny but I feel we are soul mates. Never felt that way towards any woman I’ve ever met! We’re so, so much alike and enjoy each other’s company immensely. How sad for those who feel they have to meet society’s expectations and approval concerning relationships. It’s YOUR relationship!!

Thank you for sharing. I met a gentleman who is 58 and I am 33. You story touched my heart.

I’m 45 and i date 21 yo and she loves me to death. We thinking about to get married

I was seeing someone exactly the same age difference are you. I’m 27 and hes 48 this year. We had great sex and got on so well… However we’ve stopped communicating as he finds it a struggle to come to terms with. I work within his place of work but hes of a much higher rank than me, plus he only got divorsed two years ago so I dont know if hes still coming to terms with that? I just no that there was a massive connection bewteen us both. I do really miss him.

Ashley, I would like to thank you for your post. I am 47 and I talking with a neighboring tenant’s employee hoe is 28. We’ve been out once and we both had such a great time together, no one, no even ourselves even notice the age difference. At first I felt a little weird about the age difference so I asked her. She replied, No, it doesn’t bother her at all… So I stopped worrying about it and we’re taking it one day at a time and we both want to let our relationship play out.

Wow I’ve read your article. It’s hard to accept the fact that we are getting old, but why sent ourselves the opportunity to with someone not for age but for true love. We live in a world of superficial belief. Yet here I am going to be 53 and yes I do look very. I’m healthy and my tools work just fine. And I met the most AMAZING woman that’s 29. We have everything in common and yes we will be married. She is really that soulmate that we do desperately want. So to all the men out there sometimes it’s about luck. Good luck to all the old heads out there and miss I’m sure you’re very happy with you man. Trust you’ll never live another. Good luck with all.

That’s lovely to hear I’m a 46 year old man my girlfriend is 28 I am the one who gets funny with it sometimes but I love her dearly she loves me too I do worry what people think she just tells me to calm

if it works for you never let others bring it down

This article was so enlightening. I have a friend who’s 24. She never had really been in a relationship. She’s nice, but she’s not that appealing to men her age, as she’s heavier. she started dating a 40 year old, recently divorced, kids, and he likes to play the “savior” role. It’s sad, as it’s obvious to everyone but her that he’s using her as a nanny for his kids. And because of her inexperience in relationships, he feels he can control her. He’s obviously not over his ex-wife, as he told her he hopes this (them dating) makes her (his ex) jealous. So sad that there’s men like this. Even more sad that her self-esteem is so low that she thinks this is the best she can do.

So it wasn’t weird dating someone in their 50’s I ask this because there’s this guy I kinda like but he’s 53 and I’m 36 not sure how weird that would be

I am 60 and I am very interested in a woman co-worker who is 44. There is nothing weird about it at all. Women are always more mature than their years and men usually less mature than their years. It’s like I have finally found my soul-mate after all these years. I think she feels the same way but there is still some work to do in that regard. If we do end up getting together I will be the happiest person in the world and I know I can make her happy too.

I love Harrison Ford! And Tommy Lee Jones!!

I’m in my 20s and I don’t find Harrison Ford attractive at all.

@#2 JerseyGirl, I don’t know what you are talking about, he is Han Solo and Indiana Jones.

No, @Babs; he WAS Hans Solo and Indiana Jones. Now he’s just a wealthy 60-something who looks good for his age.

I am 43 and I don’t find Harrison Ford attractive either, lol!

What older man would you find attractive ?

Similar to Selena, I met my husband when I was 35 and he was 47. At the time, the 12 years was a non-issue. Fast forward to me hitting my prime at 41, and him slowing down at 53…and it DID become a problem. He stopped wanting to travel and have fun with me. Didn’t attend important work events for me (like I had with him.) And frankly, he started aging really fast. He started looking 60, whereas he looked younger than his age when we met. We became incompatible, now divorcing.

So like Evan is saying, the age gap may not SEEM like a problem when you’re both still young-ish. But it might be a problem later. I don’t recommend more than a 7 year difference, max.

… started slowing down at 53 … WOW, Camilla, sometimes things don’t work out … but sometimes they can.

I am a 53 year old man, and am working up to compete in my first Olympic length triathlon, next year. Yes, I have to work harder to achieve my goals than a 30 year old, but I still can achieve them.

I plan to travel and have fun, and if someone 20 years my junior, who is amazingly intelligent (AND still liked my) was wanting to have a family, I am willing to negotiate terms and conditions.

well, i am 57 y.o Peter Pan …. Italian well walking around the word since 18 …. got a partner much more younger ….i understand where are you coming from …..but it is hard work….very hard after 50 stay in the life game !! you always walk on the rasoir blade line . good luck take care

I like Camila am filing for legal separation due to lack of performance of my 52 year old husband. He does not like to enjoy life not have the time since his demanding job take most of the time. If he is not tire or taking s nap recovering from his 16 to 17 hours days of work, therefore is not the age that make them old and boring but their goals and desites. If they don’t want to enjoy life like you there is no way. Ithis not about age, it is about the desire to enjoy life st the fullest. Seems that you are doing just find and if you find that special young gal to be with you why not? Good luck!

maybe you should learn to please him then I’m certain he would find a reason to cut his hours …..he put in all that time to give you things you wanted……

honest to god truth is number one reason for divorce is the woman does not please the man sexually

seriously every man except a very few will say no to sex ever….

i think it might be that you think that he is supposed to please you and his needs don’t matter to you i can see that in the words you used all through your post.

I mean my god how could any woman let her man work that many hours without telling the guy that the kids can pay for their own college and all that sort

that guy is working that kind of hours why……

Hay I an going trought a legal separation right now,my husband was working 80-100hrs pr a week and when i tell him to slow down he told me that the reason why he is working this hard is because he want’s to retire early,but all along he was only working 8hrs pr a day the rest of the hrs he was spending it with a striper,so for the past 2 and a half years he was living a double life she is 30 years he is 50, she is hi matainence and his ass is so broke he can’t even aforde a lawyer.So I don’t know what he is going to do now because he can’t afford to keep her he was only getting what he was paying for and he had that at home,a good wife 2 loving dogs health benefites ,a lovely home with a big swimming pool,good food,he did noting I did everything for him.He was busy setting up house with her he cash in his 30 thousand dollors and pay down on a condo for her and he put it in her name how stupid is that.So ladies when your husbands treates you this way don’t get angery or mad just put everything in God’s hands and only ask him to give you what he know’s is best for you,trust me he will,he did it for me and I am so happy for the first time in my life. Amen GOD IS A GOOD GOD HE NEVER LIKE’S UGLY.

Wow divorcing due to lack of performance, It’s so lucky that when we get married that we don’t make any vows to each other like “For better of for worse” In sickness and in health” ” In good times and in bad times” ” Till death do us part” I’m sure that when you got married you made at least some of those Promises ? your poor husband he probably thought he was marrying someone that would support him no matter what. Other than that if we can’t fulfill our vows and promises to each other then what is the point of marriage in the first place. Don’t do it or say or vow to your partner that I will love and support you for as long as I can, Least that’s honest.

Alba, suppose instead of a lack of performance your husband got prostate cancer or MS. Would you divorce him then? Did you take vows that said something along the line, ..”in sickness and in health, for better or for worse”?

I’m dating a girl 18 years younger than me. I met her when I was 39 and she was 22. We’ve been together for 7 years now. She’s been deployed to Kuwait and is a has been a police officer for the 7 years that I’ve know her. We love each other. I’ve been blessed with still in good physical shape, and I try to maintain a healthy lifestyle. No one is promised tomorrow. If you love someone, of age of course, then that’s all that really matters.

I thinks that’s true, l am dating a 52yr old guy and l’m 32,his the first ever man in my life who has appreciated me just the way l am, his a police officer and l’m a student nurse l like him so much , he treats me more than anyone had ever did, sex is great and he seems a descent guy, we’ve been dating for 9months and everything is great.But can l ask all guys over 50, would you cheat on your younger woman?

There you go Bob! You said it right! it doesn’t matter your age but what you want to do with your life at that point. I know men that are in their 30 and they don’t move from the couch after they come from work. Lazy “young men” :)). I’m 36 in a relationship with a 52 years old man and I can confirm…it’s the best choice i’ve made when I started dating him…he is more than a man of my age by far! Good luck to you and to all!!

I agree with you completely , Camilla cannot judge every man the same. Although I know that sex is important in a relationship, I firmly believed that sex is just a complement of the relationship, I would be more concerned if you only show me affection inside the bedroom, but what about outside the bedroom? I’m 41 years old lady, and have always been attracted to older guys since I was 18, my first boyfriend was 34 and I was just 18 years old and when I was. 34 years old I dated a 62 year old man and had a very good sex life, at that time that’s what I needed but now at. 41 years old what I craved is companionship , affection not so much just sex.

Yep, I’m the older one in our relationship and while I look and feel older than we first met he is the same. I am getting older faster than he is. If x is 30 and y is 45 that’s not too bad, but 70 and 55 seems a big difference, 70 and 85 not so much (if you make it). So it varies by lifestage.

I wouldn’t recommend a younger person just for the sake of it. If you happen to meet someone and get on very well and fall in love (as we did) then it may be worth navigating the obstacles. Otherwise, life is easier if you’re within ten years of each other I think.

Wow. Studies I have read support a maximum 6 years either way being workable.

I’d agree with you that if you are having second thoughts about that enormous age difference already, time to end it and meet someone age-appropriate.

Yes, I have many couple friends with a 10+ year difference. No problem at first, but as the years go by the problems grow. Problems in all areas. Even an active lady in her mid 70’s and her active husband of 30 years in his mid 80’s are experiencing issues with age. It will happen, just a matter of when.

Hey as a 52 year old almost 53 who works out 6 days a week, which includes weight lifting and cardio; I think the issue with your husband is not his age it’s his health and his libido etc. I am just as capable and willing in the bedroom as any 20 year old guy. I may look about 42-44 but my physique is better then a lot of 20 something’s.

im just saying your marital problems are a lot deeper then a number. Also are you sure he’s not having an affair ?

I’m sorry but a 52 year old is not the same in the bedroom as a 35 year old. Heck even men in their mid 40s are not the same as 30s. The reality that most men don’t want to accept is their sexual performance declines. I’m 38 and peaking. I would love sex several times a day. A man in his 30s is down a man in his 50s you are lucky if he can get it up that much. I’m not saying sex is the only reason or that the sex with older men is bad it’s not. It’s just not frequent enough the stamina lacks. And I’ve dated men in both age ranges.

Don’t forget: What older men lack in quantity of sex they usually make up for in quality. Experience counts for a lot, IMHO.

And with some of these relationships with 15-20 years differences, the men will be in their 60s when the woman begins to hit her prime. That’s retirement age (in more ways than one).

I’m not saying that there aren’t exceptions to the rule. But the majority will not be able to keep up.

And I don’t see why men get so offensive about this. It is rather common to hear men complain about their women not giving it up enough.

You are meeting the wrong men,I am with a 35 I am 58, and we do it in the morning and the night and day of 3 to 4 times so, if you don’t eat right, exercise, and use it you lose it. And most times she cannot even last as long as I want too.

Maybe you shouldn’t complain but seek to make your man better and healthier it all starts with commitment to a better life.

We cook at home every day, eat a good breakfast of 80 % mixed ftuit.

@Ray you are the male unicorn right? You would be amazed how many men your age say the same thing! Maybe 80%? And honestly it’s possible you are but for how long? Another 2 years? I’m not saying sex with an older man is bad just that it’s different and not the same as with younger men.

What someone eats for breakfast can only go so far and does not make a 58 year old penis suddenly 30 years old! I mean it that were the case why do we even need Viagra? Just eat well and work out? All of the older men did that that I dated and it made zero difference.

Seriously if I had a dime for every man in their 50s that said what you did I would be a rich lady! I mean it most only be men in their 80s and 90s who need viagra?

So quality of sex is not as important as quantity? Honestly when I was in my 20’s and 30’s I only did it once a day. I mean, who the Hell has time to screw 2 or 3 times a day? I mean don’t people have jobs and responsibilities? If a man is doing it 3 times a day, he needs to get a life.

As a 52 year old guy, I think your problems are much deeper than the number! I’m in the best shape of my life, look like I’m 40, lift weights, run, swim and ski. I have a physique better than most 20 or 30 year old guys – – and have more stamina (and tenderness) in the bedroom than them, as well. Sounds like your guy has given up, which is a state of mind, not a matter of age. You should dump him, but don’t think it’s his age that’s the problem.

Yet another male unicorn! Seriously ever dude over 50 looks 35 and is in great shape right? Or at least all of those commenting on here! And they all have the stamina of 30 year olds. No offense but while there may be some men over 50 that can have sex like 30 year olds and look 35 it can’t be as many as allege it! What I can’t figure out is if this is actual delusion or just stating what you want to believe?

I think YOUR husband might be the problem. Frankly, 8-12 years age difference is not a 15 or >20 years age difference. My uncles and aunts, from both paternal and maternal side, on an average have an age gap of 10 years between them. My grandparents had 14 years between them.

In short, it depends on the people involved in the relationship. And since you are evidently complaining here, you should leave him rather than making blanket statements on what you “feel” is the maximum age gap.

This really helped me. I’ve been struggling emotionally with the unknown for over 3 years now. I love my guy so much and he is so good to me. Right now I cannot imagine falling out of love with him and the thought of it brings me to tears. I am 31 and he is 53. He still works out and is in great shape and I constantly worry about our future and taking the next step. But the incompatibility in a few years is something I may not be prepared for. I’m young and he is soon to be ready for retirement and Medicare and dentures within the next decade or so. Now the thought of that is not attractive. I know we should call the quits now to save the heartache and time but I am terrified because he is the only man that has ever conquered me. But maybe because he is older…

hello loraine .. life is to live happily … if you believe and really love your man .. do not fear to marry him .. sure you will not regret later dear

Lorraine let go of the thoughts, of what may go wrong , to many people think so far into the future, they stop loving what’s in the now, remember you too can become ill and it may be him taking care of you.

Work on staying happy and improving your health and quality of life.

Love, live and laugh, and stop thinking so much.

Hang in there, and if you love this man, stick with it.

I been married for almost 23 years, been with my husband for almost 28 years – he will be 58 in two days and I am 46. And we been together since, and yes we still love each other. I was 19 and he was 32 when we began to date.

If you were single at 44, would you be just as happy to date/marry a 60 year old man about to retire?

I am in that situation now and trying to determine whether it makes sense to continue or whether I should just break it off.

It is interesting you used the term “conquered.” There are many good men, it’s a matter of finding that one that is right and never settling for less. Good luck with your decision

Hey yeah so heres a flip,

15 year gap I’ve noticed my husband way slowing down already and we’re at different natural age stages of life. I was 25 him 40, now were 27 hes 42′

Im super scared that if at him60 me 45 I’m lossing my prime and hell just fall into a sleep and im full of energy and he’ll not wanna or be even able, & wanting to do anything that wont give him a stroke!! And be like. Sigh fine. Or see yah and yeah that was great, I experienced that by myself. Wait… Then why did.I get married to SHARE my life and life experiences… To do alone……sky diving hiking kyacking

Then ill be widow at an older age and die with out that grow old togther cause he already died quite a bit before I was close to aging in.

But now ill be a bit older and not get married again due to all the guys marrying ladies in their 20s or they’re just married or just gonna be creepy and ill have a higher chance of being hit by a car ,

and I wanted to grow old with my husband not live through a death of him and date a guy a bit untill I die.

I was a cna geriatrics and am concerned of our future to where he married his future caretaker and ill be left screwed with angry underpaid.helpers cause im.poor with no family….And withoutmy loving husband a hand to squeeze.

I know thats all.horrible, but when we first.met I had nooooo idea he was that age attt alllll that age.

Then we divorced got back together, and all I see is time waisted apart how sad it’ll be to watch him get to that tough end stage of life,

Ill be there for him but hell not.be there for me.

still. soooo deeply in.love but sooo angry he’s older than I thought just cause how I was a cna and help geriatric client’s ease into their.last seconds.the future feels painful and lonely

and he’s trying so hard and struggling, is amazing passionate,

it’s like I’m in a waiting room I’m beginning world is your oyster stage and he has already had his oyster and needs to sit out so I’m going to wait .

Gallll I lovelove love him he gets my heart but I’m sad at the truth of what happens.in the end how come I.couldn’t have a.man.I could grow.old with. I looove him.but. With what I said do i? Or am.I just depressed?? Perhaps crazy… Or honest. We alll die. But freaking crap I didnt want at allll to die that much earlier than my husband.

Grow old together, not watch you grow hecka old slowly die while I slowly watch and grow a hurt back to now deal with alone and poor due to medication s and medical bills and funeral.

start over a new relationship or spend the next 20years alone depressed my husband died so yung,

rather old just quick do to age gap so.not.enough time.

I wanted to be.old and wrinkly WITH him not, still mildly sleek and him in the grave it just hurts. Ive seen sooo many mourn the death of spouses , and

now I get to out live by 20 thats honestly a lot

to restart a relationship, life and identify

and the quality of life in those later years my goodness.

I think being in the medical field had really really jaded me and I hope distorted my view. And this all crazy talk but.I’VE seen it all toooooo much I need a ray of light.

Not to mention honestly are you as fast as you were when you were 20s as in 60? Orrrrr 70s vers 30?? Noooo the gap and body progression is real and when you hit 42 you age 6 months quicker every x amount. Don’t remember the exact fact but it’s real.

Sorry this is in a reply,

15 year gap I’ve noticed my husband way slowing down already and we’re at different natural age stages of life. I was 25 him 40, now were 27 hes 42′

Im super scared that if at him60 me 45 I’m lossing my prime and hell just fall into a sleep and im full of energy and he’ll not wanna or be even able, & wanting to do anything that wont give him a stroke!!

Then ill be widow at an older age and die with out that grow old togther cause he already died quite a bit before I was close to aging in.

But now ill be a bit older and not get married again due to all the guys marrying ladies in their 20s or they’re just married or just gonna be creepy and ill have a higher chance of being hit by a car ,

and I wanted to grow old with my husband not live through a death of him and date a guy a bit untill I die.

I was a cna geriatrics and am concerned of our future to where he married his future caretaker and ill be left screwed.

I know thats all.horrible, but when we first.met I had nooooo idea he was that age attt alllll that age.

Then we divorced got back together, and all I see is time waisted apart how sad it’ll be to watch him get to that tough end stage of life,

Ill be there for him but hell not.be there for me.

still. soooo deeply in.love but sooo angry he’s older than I thought just cause how I was a cna and help geriatric client’s ease into their.last seconds.the future feels painful and lonely

and he’s trying so hard and struggling, is amazing passionate,

it’s like I’m in a waiting room I’m beginning world is your oyster stage and he has already had his oyster and needs to sit out so I’m going to wait .

Gallll I lovelove love him he gets my heart but I’m sad at the truth of what happens.in the end how come I.couldn’t have a.man.I could grow.old with.

Do allllll the younger people a favor thats more than 7-8 years difference.

BEFORE feelings adheres put up a boundaries out of love and respect of THEIR life. You already had your 20s why take another s cause when you 70 and theyre 55 thats a huge difference in those years especially.

Your stealing years and hopes and dreams of the life of healthy age progression TOGETHER .

I wish he would.have told me before I was tooooo deep in.

He could have found.someone his age I could.have. Now im.stuck.With watching him.dye slowly or random and grieving alone and then maybe date wish it was my husband then die alone all wrinkly knowing he never saw me wrinkly. ): old hold my hand while im dying.

Sorry I’ve had sooooo many clients die , natural age progression or illnesses and cancers,

and its saaaaaddd watching them mourn but not as well.

theyre close to end slowly dying, and happy cause they have each other and knew it was close and are at peace but the ones who dies decade s before the other and also alone. Tragic. The pain is soooo real. And ask allllll the time why. And I ask why 15 years.

Didnt spell.it right but I looove my husband I’m just devastated currently of the truth of mortality and time and age stages on the human body.

Well I’m 41 my husband is 63 and I don’t thin I’ll ever think of sleeping with another man other than him he is delicious. I love my husband and he adores me. Neo

I don’t feel like these issues you denoted are age-related. Not wanting to travel or go to functions is a problem in personality differences than age. This insinuates that when Camilla hits 53 she won’t want to travel either – I bet that’s not the case. You two may have been a bad fit but I think the age difference may have been a red herring here.

Oh boy is this one interesting. Some choice quotes from Evan’s answer”

“Don’t get me wrong, there are advantages in a 45-year-old guy. He’s probably a man. He’s got the job and the home and the car, and been divorced with a kid already. So if a woman finds it more appealing to just step into that world to jump from the prolonged adolescence of the late 20’s into full-fledged settled-down womanhood that could make sense.”

“There are many other things that are attractive about older men. They embody wisdom and stability. They can afford nicer restaurants and vacations and have cultivated greater tastes in the arts. They’re more experienced, more chivalrous, and more likely to want to settle down than a twentysomething party boy.”

” . . .they’re daddy substitutes. An older man’s going to be the strong, nurturing guy who takes care of her, teaches her, and treats her like a princess the kind of relationship that she probably lacked growing up.”

So I break this down into 2 basic reasons women go for older guys.

Materially, Evan said it well – “He’s got the job and the home and the car . . ” and “They can afford nicer restaurants and vacations and have cultivated greater tastes in the arts.”

Daddy issues – I’d venture to say that I think both extremes apply here. Evan wrote, “… treats her like a princess the kind of relationship that she probably lacked growing up.” I’d say that I’ve run into just as many daddy issues with girls who WERE treated like princesses by daddy.

No matter which reason(s) applies, it’s the same thing in effect. She wants to be treated like a child. She wants to be immature.

My father treated me very well lots of love from him I wouldn’t say my dad treated me like a princess but I’m 24 my boyfriend is 53 we been going for three yes and still going sstrong he is one of the best men I have ever been with he has money to pay pills and food and every other weekend we go out so I’m surely not dating him for money but more for we have a lot in common he has a wonder full personality and we have fun with eachother so maybe I like him for him not his age I sometimes for get he is 53

I’m also 24 and my boyfriend is 44. We’ve only been together for a year but like you Tawntawnee we have some of the best times of my life. He’s an amazing man and we have a lot in common. I never thought I’d date someone so much older than I am but we’re definitely not together for the money even though he pays when were together. I can take care of myself financially for now and if we stay together longer I imagine us having a similar dynamic as any younger couple where we work together not just me living off of him. As far as the daddy issues go I can’t say I have one my father was the greatest man I’ve ever known and I loved him completely. He’s no longer with me physically but he taught me what love looks like through his relationship with my mother and thats what I want for myself. And thats how I feel with my boyfriend, I learn a lot with him, as I’d expect to learn from any relationship I’m in.

Posey…. Awesome words you write. It’s reassuring to know that you, and others with considerable age gaps, have wonderful relationships. I am 52, my g/f is 35. We have been dating for 7 weeks. I separated 20 months ago from my wife of 23 years. I never imagined being with a woman 17 years my junior. Not that it was out of the question, it just never entered my mind that I would be with a woman much younger than myself.

I have no age-gap hangups/issues and neither does she. We enjoy each other very much. Moreso me than her at the moment… I Love her and want to spend what time I have left in this life soley with her. She isn’t ‘quite’ ready to commit at that level yet (hopefully one day).

We have Many things in common, one of which, would be Very difficult to replicate. I ‘Know’ that she is the one for me. I’d ask her to marry me today, but taking her ‘commitment’ issues (at the moment) into account, I don’t want to scare her off and loose her forever.

We are not ‘Exclusive’ to each other at this point. I want to be, but she doesn’t want to have that ‘restriction’. I have asked her if she has seen anyone else since we met and she told me no. That is reassuring, but I am very paranoid that she may toss me to the curb for another, possibly, younger guy.

Hopefully it will all work out and we spend the rest of our days together… ??

This inspires me. I’ve been with my boyfriend for two years now. I’m 23 and he is 50. I met him when I was 21 and he was 48. I’ve never been happier with him. He’s an amazing man and I couldn’t have asked for a better friend, lover, and companion. I’m not with him for the money or whatever. He is mature and I’m not with him because I want to be immature. So reading through most of the replies kind of makes me sad of course. And I forget constantly he’s 50. He looks like he’s in his early 40s and acts even younger than that. We have so much in common and we have so much fun together. I haven’t met anyone who is in a similar relationship…so I don’t have anything to go on. But I love the life I share with him. I never think about the age difference and I never think about the time we have or don’t have. Reading through the comments makes me sad again when I think about sure…in 20 years I will be 43 and he will be 70. But I’m living in the moment with him and I HAVE NEVER BEEN HAPPIER. Good luck to you and your man.

If both of you are clear about the (most likely) temporary nature of your relationship more power to you. I think it’s pretty clear that your situation is the exception rather than the rule (if this isn’t in fact some shill posting by a dude trying to make a point).

Anyway, if what you say is true then you aren’t really disproving the points made on here. Most relationships with a large age gap, whether the man or woman is older, tend not to last. Eventually that age difference starts to matter. He will likely face losing you when his age starts to show, and it will. No one is immune to time. The human body breaks down and “stuff” stops working so well. We get slower and less healthy.

Things may be all fun and laughs now but when you turn 33 and start to think about the fact that he is 60 you may feel very differently about the relationship. Most young people eventually want to start a family and if the father is old enough to be the kids Grandpa you’ll have some issues. At that point you may decide an attractive and vibrant 40 year old better suits your lifestyle, but your current man may not want to let you go. He may want you to stick around, be his support and “grow old with him” but find himself alone at the later stage of his life. It’s a risky investment and he has a lot more to lose than you do. You’ve got time to have some flings and start over. I’d make the same argument for either gender, by the way. It’s just a matter of being at the same stage of life.

Thank you very much . I’m 47 and my gf 21 she loves me so much but i was worried. Thanks again

this is lovely Bri. I hope everything is still going well for the two of you- I’m in the exact same situation… Best of luck!

I’m 26 and my man is 55yrs old but my experience is that they can be controlling and jealous…I’ve been 6 months in with him..My relationship with kind of been bumy.I’m also a mother of 4 children. Older men wants a lot of attention…lM special of him…but I’ll give him one more month to see..lol

My experience was also that older men are controlling and jealous and want a lot of attention.

I was one of those who didn’t understand it was Daddy issues, I was 20 he was 37. We were in love and I followed at the plans he had for me, career and otherwise and he gave me the acceptance and approval I wasn’t getting from my Dad at the time. Well after 2 kids and 15 years married together I couldn’t take it anymore him making all the decisions for both of us and we divorced. He is having a hard time now dating because he’s 55 and yes fit and active but no one this age wants to be told how to live life.

This comment really bothers me. As if men can only agree or see relevance when their age group or kind is the exact type of men referenced. You know what’s wrong with 20-39 year old men…?

1. They are willing to throw away long loving relationships with women for a night of lust. Men this age will chest and justify it like no other age group. Risking family life and hurting his partner.

2. You have to beg these men to get std test because they act as if their fragile little ego is so offended by something they should do anyway.

3. They have never dealt with adversity. The slightest hardship will result in a nervous breakdown and the woman will be stuck babying them back to their male privilege health.

4. They are fake cultured. They travel the globe and take Snapchat but know nothing of the culture or people that they visit other than to sound pseudo cultured. Please.

5. They think experimenting with drugs is a romantic activity. No matter what socioeconomic class.

Older men are men. They are decisive. They know how to open doors, let a woman relax, be sensitive when needed and string where it counts. They know it’s not about a photo but how the experience transcended you. They’re not looking to rendezvous with your best friend. Or play stupid don’t text too soon child games. Millennial men are ridiculous and also now highly feminized. I will pass!

Great post. Especially the last paragraph. Spot on.

“And frankly, he started aging really fast. He started looking 60, whereas he looked younger than his age when we met. ”

Most unflattering reasons, but likely true as “the rule” :

younger women being attracted to older men

younger men being attracted to older women

women and men wanting to date/mate younger:

2. more immature than their chronological counterparts

3. wants a partner more easily controlled

4. an ego stroke, arm candy, a trophy partner

Despite all of those unflattering dime store( a very “dating” remark…..amend that..to “dollar store”) reasons, sometimes these various pairings happen only because the two people involved have a genuine appreciation of each other.

I think you have a great point. But I have to add older men are better in bed too….I was 23 and my ex was 36…and yes he robbed the cruddle. He wanted to mold me to what he wanted…the only trouble there is, I did grow up. As for daddy issues. My dad was never around at my young age….I seriously had more fun with my ex. I tried dating younger men my age but they didn’t want a serious relationship….commitment phobics. Lol. Damn if you do, and damn if you don’t….lol

Bingo! And the young shall grow. And sherry, 36 was old for you but he could perform, fast forward 10 years and you probably won’t say the same.

We are taking about 45+ Guys here, so your case doesn’t really applies. Write back when he is 55.

True, when the older man is 36, he’s still a young man. When the older man is 53, like Camilla’s soon to be xh upthread, it’s a different matter. Somebody called ‘B’ advised Camilla to try harder to please her husband. That made me roll my eyes a bit. Honestly, why go out with a much older man if you still have to work hard to please him! Surely the pay off of going out with a much older man is that he is working very hard to please you!!

Lols. So a 13 year age gap is a daddy issue? Must be really a f***ked up situation to be a father at 13.

On the latter one of older seeking younger ad #6. want a family that someone of my own age can’t or unlikely to be able to do.

And whose doing is that? So like Evan is saying, the age gap may not SEEM like a problem when you’re both still young-ish. But it might be a problem later. I don’t recommend more than a 7 year difference, max.

you wish. It’s not natural. And yes you can appreciate your dad.keep dreaming, nothing wrong with. Even if it starts out that way, the youngin will grow and realize the folly of youth. Once she starts getting older, she’s gonna want someone that keeps her young. Better make sure she has no financial assets to take care of herself. If you are very rich, she will still leave you and collect alimony. If you are poor, she won’t marry you to begin With. People can find others their own age to appreciate. Unless you are a movie star or famous person, keep dreaming. Appreciation is not a reason to get married.

I’m 24 my man is 53 been together 3 years and still going strong he doesn’t have tons of money enough to pay bill s and and food in our mouth and once and a wile go town town he has his own place but I have a wonderfull father who always showed me love and took good care of me so it isn’t daddy issues for me i dont date this older man for his money cause he doesn’t have much I am cause I liked him his personality his everything ??

I think it’s a beautiful thing,I’m 41 and I have a 20 year old. and it’s like we’re both wildfires! We both care for each other,and we never talk about our age we just live life one day at a time.

Does she have the opportunity to become everything she possibly can be in life while in a relationship with you?

“I dont date this older man for his money cause he doesn’t have much I am cause I liked him his personality his everything.”

Amen! I’ve been married to my older guy for 26 years now, and I think that “daddy issues” are something fabricated by younger guys who can’t or won’t compete. It’s a sour-grapes sort of rationalization. I love my older man because he’s a wonderful man, full stop. We both had jobs for the first part of our marriage and he made more but I didn’t do too badly. Now we are both retired and we are closer than ever. My own dad was affectionate with his 3 daughters but it was clear that my mom was his girl. That is what I got.

My ex left me for a 22 year md singer and dancer. He was 56. I was shocked that he he married her. She had nothing to give him. She took my home belongings, had an Invitro baby. I never had closure. May she have the dump of her life.

Why are you mad at her and not him? He was the one in a committed relationship with you and he left you.

Oh dear, you’ve clearly never been in this position or you’d understand. In my case, the woman had the nerve to call me (the wife of the man she was sleeping with) to demand that I “give” her my husband when he didn’t leave me fast enough. The sense of entitlement this woman displayed was truly unbelievable. After he left, she called again to gloat and lord it over me that she’d “Won.” So, yeah, I’m happy to see that harpy fall on her face.

If he didn’t CHEAT on you with her, she wouldn’t EVER have called you.

So yes, she was a harpy. But HE was the cheater. You should be cursing HIM to hell and back.

This is why I don’t ever get women getting upset with women their men cheated with. It’s the person WITH THE COMMITMENT that should be tarred and feathered. But noooo. The Other Woman (to whom he could have lied to get her into bed) is at fault.

Please. Ladies, sure get mad at the woman, too. But it’s YOUR MAN who cheated. He’s the one you’re supposed to hate and curse out. The other woman is irrelevant to your anger.

If this simple logic is not something you gals can get your arms around, no wonder there is so much dysfunction once a woman gets into a relationship. Wow.

Karmic: WOW is right. Neither of us ever said we weren’t also furious with our husbands. Of COURSE I hold him responsible for his cheating! When did I ever say otherwise?

Frankly, I blame both of them for their actions. Two people made a choice to betray their spouses and destroy two families. Now both have paid the price for that choice. She is now a single mother with no support and he wants to come home to me but that door is permanently closed.

Your comment: “If this simple logic is not something you gals can get your arms around, no wonder there is so much dysfunction once a woman gets into a relationship,” is both condescending and antagonistic. Those are some pretty snide assumptions you are making there, especially considering that I never said anything you could base those on in my comment.

Furthermore, the “Other Woman” in my case was well acquainted with our family personally. She knew me and our young children. Our kids played together for crying out loud. She is a Narcissistic Gold Digger so, no, she was not some innocent victim that my husband lied to. Rest assured, I cursed them BOTH to “hell and back” in the months following.

These days I’ve found some degree of forgiveness though, just for my own peace of mind, not because I condone what they did. She’s not a very well balanced lady and I recognize that my ex husband is not a well man but I spent decades trying to help him. There’s only so much you can do for someone when they refuse to help themselves. I won’t be his “enabler” anymore. He made the choice to abandon his family and now he’ll have to live with the consequences.

I like your posts. But you’re going to have see it from what I saw written, not what you DIDN’T write.

Most women on this board vilify uncommitted men (commitment phobes, man-children, narcissists, etc.) with no compunction.

Yet the posts where bfs and husbands who cheated were concerned, the women vilify “the other woman” and only mention their bf/husband as a side note, if at all. (ala Sharon, you, Stephan).

To me this is so illogical, why vilify a man who hasn’t committed to (generic) you — and who has a right to not commit — only to vilify the other woman, when the MAN — who was in the relationship with you — should be one vilified.

All three of you only mentioned all the details after I challenged what was written.

And it happens not only on this board, but IRL, as I’ve witnessed women fighting over a bf/cheater. Why would EITHER woman do that.

I’m sorry your husband cheated and you did the right thing.

However, I stand by my words that most women – illogically – get MADDER at “the other woman” than at their man. The anger seems so disproportionate to the offender. I don’t understand this.

“You’re going to have see it from what I saw written, not what you DIDN’T write.”

No, you’re going to “have to see” that what you are clearly doing here is criticizing us for what we DIDN’T write, rather than what we did. We didn’t hit the specific bullet points YOU thought should be included in a very quick response on a forum, how all the blame should be on the husband (though, IMHO, the Mistress doesn’t get off scot-free unless she was totally unaware he was married). So you took it upon yourself to inform us of how very deluded we all are without any background information. A lot of the things you mentioned in both your previous comment and this one seem to be pulled out of thin air and are not based upon anything I’ve ever said. I could pluck all kinds of things out of the ether and sound off on you for neglecting to mention them. For example: You never even ONCE brought up the plight of MEN who were cheated on so, by your own logic, you must not even care about them. Now see how silly that sounds? I’m not going to make assumptions about how you feel about things that didn’t happen to get mentioned. Just because something didn’t come up in this particular comment doesn’t mean you don’t have feelings about it. Ditto for the rest of us. Don’t assume you know how we feel about something we HAVEN’T mentioned. If you actually care how we feel about something just ask before you criticize, unless criticizing is really all you wanted to do in the first place. If that’s the case, there’s really no point in further discussion.

“Most women on this board vilify uncommitted men (commitment phobes, man-children, narcissists, etc.) with no compunction. Yet the posts where bfs and husbands who cheated were concerned, the women vilify “the other woman” and only mention their bf/husband as a side note, if at all. (ala Sharon, you, Stephan).”

Please show me where I said that all men must commit to a woman. If a guy doesn’t want to be in a committed relationship that’s totally his choice and I’ll completely respect that, though I’d hope he’s honest about his intentions to anyone he dates. The comment I replied to was specifically about an “Other Woman.” I responded to what the poster was talking about. Forgive me for not expounding upon the topic to your satisfaction.

“Why vilify a man who hasn’t committed to (generic) you…”

and who has a right to not commit…

(Absolutely, he does. Not arguing with you at all here)

Only to vilify the other woman, when the MAN — who was in the relationship with you — should be one vilified. All three of you only mentioned all the details after I challenged what was written.”

Oh, I vilified him in spades. The reason I didn’t tell the entire sordid story in my first response was because I was just responding to someone’s post. Was I under some obligation to tell you every tiny detail right off the bat? Do you get to dictate what we share publicly and when?

“And it happens not only on this board, but IRL, as I’ve witnessed women fighting over a bf/cheater. Why would EITHER woman do that. However, I stand by my words that most women – illogically – get MADDER at “the other woman” than at their man. The anger seems so disproportionate to the offender. I don’t understand this.”

I not sure I agree that MOST women do this, but I agree it’s stupid. I took out the majority (though admitted not all) of my anger on HIM. I can kind of understand why some women might react this way though, even if I do think it’s illogical. There is no emotional investment in the woman. She is not someone the wife has a deep attachment to, therefore, it is easier to forgive the guy and blame the outside enemy. Not condoning it, just considering why it might happen.

I can only comment on my impressions on what was disclosed.

If you didn’t like being challenged on what you wrote then write in the relevant details. You felt the relevant details was to name call the woman. What I saw was a pattern of women getting madder at the woman and not at the man because the cheated upon/left women only mentioned the man in passing, which gave the impression he wasn’t the target of the hatred, but the “other woman” was.

I would have commented differently had you (and Stephan and Sharon) wrote with as much anger towards the man as towards the woman. Maybe I wouldn’t have commented at all.

I questioned and commented upon the anger and animosity clearly displayed in the posts towards “the other woman.” There was clearly no such anger and animosity towards the man in writing.

OK so, since I have now adequately provided the “relevant details” that you specifically require of anyone posting to Evan’s forum (that I was also angry at my ex for cheating .. Duh) we can drop this now, right? Have fun. I’m out.

Mine left me for a younger woman as well, after putting us all through total hell for two decades with his drug addiction. It did make me wonder how many of these May/December romances occur because he has left his family for the younger woman. That puts a whole different spin on things. A man in his 40s or 50s is likely either married or divorced. Sadly, it’s all too common. Dude goes through a mid life crisis, leaves wife and kids for a younger POA who makes him feel all youthful again.

I obviously can’t tell you what will happen with your ex, but the odds sure aren’t in their favor. In my case, the ex got extremely irritated by his “Mistress” pretty darn quickly and deeply regretted his decision to leave us for her within three weeks. Too late sucker. No take backs! He stuck with her anyway for a while to avoid being alone but he did eventually dump her. I have to admit that it makes me quite happy to see that SHE is now a single mother too because she left her husband to steal mine. Karma is a beautiful thing!

Taking pleasure in the suffering of others isn’t Karma, it’s sadism.

Walk a mile Derek, then come back and lecture me on my morality. I’ve been quite a lot kinder to both parties who hurt me deeply than almost anyone else would have been.

Or the women at my age “48” can’t keep up with me and i want a women who can – I hike – ski – shoot guns – lift weights – run – I like to get out – perhaps 98% of all women at the age of 48 are n longer interested in those things – as for myself I crave activity – so yes while I look for a woman my own age I never find one that meets me on all levels – younger woman do

The longest, best romantic relationship I ever had was with a much older guy. I knew he was older, but I didn’t know how much older. When I found out I was shocked b/c it was a LOT older. All that said, we were very much in love and it felt like we were equals. I know that people looked at us and thought things — esp. b/c he’s highly successful in our field (he’s won several of one of the big 3 awards, shall we say) and I was a rank beginner. (Well, not rank.) But even there, I didn’t feel that we were mismatched b/c he was successful and I was starting out — it was more that we were in different places in our careers. And, it turns out, in our lives. He had done a lot of the things that I still needed to do to feel like I’d lived (marriage, a kid, real estate, career success — though I can skip the multiple divorce part, thanks). But we never talked about that stuff — we were just into each other and our work together. And when I started to talk about a LIFE together he started to lie (actually, he was lying from the beginning) — he didn’t want to lose me but he didn’t want to build anything with me. I could still be his perma-girlfriend today, had I wanted that spot, and be meeting the people and going to the “events.” And I’m telling you, it was great interpersonally with this guy, but I had to leave and have nothing to do with him, even though it meant taking many steps backwards professionally. (I’m kinda proud in my work, so that actually felt like a relief.) And now I’m fine and dating guys who don’t raise eyebrows when we’re out together. It isn’t the rush it was being with this guy, and maybe it does feel like settling. But it also feels like peace and happiness.

I do know many successful May-December couples. The woman is most often the younger, but not always. In that particular situation it’s really hard b/c the guy starts losing his health a few decades before the woman will, and so she’ll (most likely) have to see him through his illness and death and then (possibly) be alone for a very long time. And if you are marrying a guy for his “stability” — meaning, you may be attracted to him to fill in some gaps in your own abilities — well, unless you learn in your time with him how to manage a portfolio and deal with all of the stuff that comes with settling an estate, that “stability” may not seem like such a gift.

OK. Gotta get off the internet. My eHarmony guy is gonna call in a few. He’s 3 years older than I am. Not as exciting as Award Man, but very funny, nice.

Older guys: higher social value. More money, more real estate, knowledge, culture, wisdom, well traveled, higher social/emotional intelligence. I totally buy younger women going for older men. See it all the time.

I’ve got a question. Let’s say a 28 year old goes out with a 45 year old VRD (very rich dude). They only plan on being together for 15 years, give or take. Basically a really long LTR or a planned mid-term marriage. Does anyone have a problem with this? I don’t. He gets what he wants (fantasies fulfilled, feels younger, arm candy, whatever), and she gets what she wants that is, a comfortable life.

Lance, the only problem is at 60, the old guy will not let the 43 year old go. He can’t find another 40 year old but she can. See where I’m going with this? Can she, yes she can but she has to be wise.

… can’t find another 40 year old … One small fact that most people overlook – although many deny it, but there actually is a shortage of men suitable to marry. I am 53 and am on friendly terms with several women in their 40s, who are keenly looking for someone to settle down with. There are few single men out there who are economically viable, and who have got their act together. BUT there are plenty of women, desperately lonely, and will do almost everything to have someone love and care for them. There are many more 40 year old women than there are 40 year old men.

Yes !! I am 45, I seem to be attracting younger 27-35 and 58-68′ year old men . In person as well as online . As well I find it hard to write a profile that reflects the truth of your expectations vs sounding like the ‘ cougar ‘ . . My ex is 66 , wasn’t age that was the issue . I have dated ages both ways . Love that quote ” I see

Have you seen what some 50 year old women look like these days. They make 20 year olds envious!!

Yep. Someone who most people know of, Sandra Bullock, has just been voted most beautiful woman in the world (in some poll) and she is a beauty at 51, and another familiar face, Christie Brinkley is a total knockout at 61, but there are plenty of beauties of that age on match etc. There’s no excuse for looking frumpy at any age any more for either gender.

Yes. Women in their 40’s and 50’s are in their prime these days. They can be much sexier than a lot of women in their 20’s and 30’s. They have lots of experience and many good years ahead of them.

I’m 45 and my fiance just turned 27..we’re happily in love , I don’t see anything wrong with it, she is pretty hot and beautiful..I was married for 23 yrs before i found out my wife was cheating, I got divorced, then I met her, her family loves me..not once did her family or mine question our relationship. .the way I see it, people are going to talk shit whether she’s 27 or 45..my kids like her, that’s all that matters..life is too short to worry about, what anybody thinks..happiness is hard to find and we found it in each other, as long as there is love, trust and communication.. we will be together for a long long time..

You want a young woman she wants a young man too. Think maybe it is security and stability that starts that “fire”….

Well, if the woman thinks ahead, she’ll see the problem with this. When the relationship ends she’ll be 43 and hitting the same problems the rest of us are finding relationships at that age.

Our healthy, vibrant 40 something peers all want women in their 20’s and 30’s, NOT us. We’re stuck with much younger and much older men being the only ones showing interest. The younger men just want sex. So, here you are, a woman in your 40’s. You still look good and feel young, but the only men who want a real relationship with you are over 55.

You know that if you get involved with a man more than ten years older you’ll be facing what some of the other posters are complaining about here, their men are suddenly aging quickly and they are stuck with a “patient” rather than a “partner.”

I completely agree and disagree as well yes in that sense ick .

not quite correct cause, sure some most likely a yeas thats whats up, nasty predatory denile nastys.

But if you actually fell in love . As a couple.

you now get to slowly watch them die and their soul fade and cry that why the hell did he have to be 15 years older. Cause the person at a real loveing level alll you love about them , you watch their body age and them struggle to communicate and talk and it killllls you.

So no it’s not all a stereotype or can be generalized, and only is ever the case of intent to free rich ride and both predatory and nasty,

Some people actually love the person and the traits that create them and didnt know the age or couldnt tell and then love is there so oh well and too late.

So after you get to watch older spouse’s body fail long before yours while they die old, youl both never experience that together cause the decade and some, you get to greive the loss for evvver and now your primes spent and only guys left at your age are d bags or married or creepy . And.you statistically more likely to get killed in a terism attack.

I think people should be mindful on the younger and understand what you could be taking and be kind enough to say no.And marry your own age or closer and form a relationship to love with someone your own age. Wish he would have pushed me away a to save aallll this death pain. He could have found someone his age. I love him.but why didnt he love me enough to.KNOW what I would.have to deal.with at his end. It was selfish

Oh I can related to that “being with an older guy is a rush thing”. I briefly – very briefly – dated a 50 year old. He just knocked my socks off. Obviously it didn’t work out, and there were other incompatibilities, but yah, this guy still had it!

Lance wrote: “I’ve got a question. Let’s say a 28 year old goes out with a 45 year old VRD (very rich dude). They only plan on being together for 15 years, give or take. Basically a really long LTR or a planned mid-term marriage. Does anyone have a problem with this? I don’t. He gets what he wants (fantasies fulfilled, feels younger, arm candy, whatever), and she gets what she wants that is, a comfortable life.”

Do THEY jointly plan on being together for 15 years? Or does She? I ask because the VRD can live like Hef (cialis, viagra). What’s the payout to her?

No offense, still sounds like legalized prostitution.

Wait, isn’t that much of what it is anyway?

And don’t forget events, Lance. The grown-up events are very nice, and not something that a young guy can bring you to. It’s hard for me now to go to hipster events where people have been throwing up on the steps outside.

My family background has made me naturally drawn toward older people (friends and romantic interests alike). My siblings are all between 10-17 years older than me, my dad is 10 years older than my mom, my grandfather was 12 years older than my grandmother…for us it’s kind of the norm. Granted the 10-12 year age difference isn’t 17-25+, but it’s greater than average.

My interests have also tended to be “older” for my age. I’ve never been into the bar/club scene, can count on one hand the number of concerts by artists with a younger fan base, and enjoy the opera, symphonies, museums, etc, that generally tend to have an older audience.

I have noticed, though, that as I’ve gotten older that I’m less inclined to consider a relationship where there is a much larger age gap. In my early adult years I would have considered dating someone 20 years older than me, but now that’s down to about 10-12 years. Perhaps the fact that guys closer to my age are finally maturing has something to do with it. I’m also interested in some activities (like skydiving or whitewater rafting) that guys above a certain age have zero interest in, so that’s also helping to keep the age difference to one that’s fairly minimal.

And lastly, in regards to the sugar daddy (or rich older man) phenomeon. Not necessarily the case. I’m currently deliberating over a guy who’s far older than he looks (he looks 10 years younger), who’s sweet as can be, and is the best looking man I’ve seen in years (not just seen romantically, but seen in real life anywhere). Financially though, I suspect I have far more assets. I own my home, and wouldn’t be surprised if earn twice what he does. And though I know the golddigger comments are going to be coming out, that is a concern as he is 17 years older than me (and hence should be that much further along financially) and I’m not earning the executive salaries that the men on this board often comment about. But he’s still very tempting…

Y’all can keep Harrison Ford, I want Robert Redford! Though I also know more than a few young ladies with a thing for Sean Connery…

Hmm. I can’t think of any older actors who really do it for me. But this topic is curious b/c just today I read that Adrienne Barbeau is with Billy Van Zandt (she’s about 12 years older); and Barbara Hershey is with that stunner Naveen Andrews from “Lost” (she’s 21 years older); and I don’t know if any of you have seen Kim Basinger lately, but she is an incredible-looking 50-something (for any age, really), and I’m sure that there is many a young guy who’d park his horse in her stable. (I believe she is an animal lover.) These days a lot of women are holding onto their hotness. It’s a nice trend. ??

Prostitution is very quid pro quo, Vino. A relationship isn’t because you have feelings for each other. Would each have the same feelings if he were an old loser and she were a young ugly thing? Maybe. But they probably wouldn’t be attracted to each other long enough to find out. Relationship currency isn’t like REAL currency. It’s just what you offer, materially yes, but in other ways, too. Really, the insult is to the guy in the “prostitution” idea you are putting forth — money is all he has to offer and he’s so out of touch emotionally that he would think that someone who is using him really cares about him? I don’t think men are that stupid.

Yep, that is what it boils down to and that’s why it’s so common in 3rd world countries. It is not normal to fall in love with someone who looks like your dad. But if he promises security, you might take him on the offer. That’s a transaction , period. I admit you might grow to care for such a person but chances are he chose the inexperienced girl to manipulate. When she grows up, game over. Some will even get you working 16 hours straight overnight hours whilst they sleep with their pot bellies hanging out. man I’m mad

What you’re failing to realize here is that HE is using HER just as much as she is using him. In the situation you’ve laid out the man is only interested in the younger woman because she is pretty. He doesn’t give a crap about her as a whole person.

“Prostitution is very quid pro quo, Vino.”

It’s good of you to admit it. I’ll remember that next time someone demands that men pay for everything.

Also, you seem to ignore the premise that Lance set forth, upon which I based my comment.

“It’s just what you offer, materially yes, but in other ways, too. Really, the insult is to the guy in the prostitution idea you are putting forth money is all he has to offer and he’s so out of touch emotionally that he would think that someone who is using him really cares about him? I don’t think men are that stupid.”

What does SHE offer? What other ways? See this link http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/why-does-my-boyfriend-want-less-sex-than-me/#comment-6810. Deathslayer writes yet another priceless post. It’s too long to quote fully here, but it is on point. A choice quote or 2, so people can link over…

If you women no longer have vaginas, how would you

Man you could hear a pin drop…”

“He said something like this. What’s wrong with you? You could have said, learn to play pool, take him to a sports game, or boating. There were a ton of things you could have done to be with your man and make him happy. But the only way all you women could define yourselves was as three holes and nothing else.

“They wanted women for those things money CAN’T buy, love, respect, a warm home to come home to, their own children and a good woman to raise them.”

Many guys 45 & up are not that out of touch emotionally aren’t that out of touch. You are right. They are not that stupid. They just accept it as the cost of admission, like paying a membership fee to join a country club or a cover charge to enter a night club. It’s not an insult to the guy in the ‘prostitution’ idea, just a realistic statement of the nature of the situation.

Along with the possible reasons Evan cited for a younger woman seeking out an older man is also that women in their 20’s-early 30’s may have tired of the young men in their age bracket who treat sex, relationships as sport, conquests and are looking for something more substantial and lasting.

Older women appreciate younger men for the same reasons older men appreciate younger women. Younger men are more likely to have a flat stomach and all their hair. Also, regarding the perception that women over 40 are “hard”–‘some’ men over 40 are quite rigid in their expectations and ‘some’ of them are so bitter you wonder why they are dating in the first place. Perhaps to get back to that time of life when sex and relationships were merely sport and conquests?

Those observations aside, we still do tend to find someone we really connect with when we’re truly open to it. At any age.

Harrison Ford is not of my generation, but he popped into my generation’s attention in the first “Star Wars” movie when he was in his 30’s and my girlfriends and I were in our teens. It’s been a pleasure to watch him over the last 30 yrs. He’s aged remarkably well.

Is there an entertainment star you admire (or did as a teen) who is 12 or more yrs. your senior? If so, it might amuse you in the coming decades to see how well THEY age.

How would being divorced with a kid appeal to younger women who are neither divorced nor have a kid?

My husband was divorced with a kid when I met him. Love knows no stopping- I loved his little girl like the continuation of him…

This is what i believe happens when you really love someone….

some men over 40 are quite rigid in their expectations and some of them are so bitter you wonder why they are dating in the first place.

— or hanging out on dating blogs. Some of them are younger too.

The founder of E-Harmony says 6 years either way is about tops. I agree for a host of reasons. It’s a matter of sameness…the more you have the same, ie. background, education, culture, AGE… the more likely the relationship will survive long term. The more differences there are, the more you’ll have to get around. My Dad on the other hand married a woman 25 years younger than he and from a culture half way around the world…been married over 40 years and raised 2 kids. Go figure. The longer you live however, the less age diffference makes a difference. A 40 year old married to a 20 year old would raise some eyebrows. However an 80 year old with a 60 year old? No big deal. I frankly, as much as I’m attracted to the younger form, do not want a gal who is more concerned with things like child rearing if I’m more into retirement planning. Stage of life issues. As my Mom used to say, “find someone you have a lot in common with”.

Yes I’ve noticed that as well. Seems like a waste of time, but if you don’t have anything else to do…?

I disagree that age difference matters less with age. At age 60, many (most?) people are still quite active. At 80 that is much, much less the case–frailty is more the norm.

The 20’s is an era of such personal change, usually more so than later decades so a relationship between a 20 yr. old and a 40 yr. old might prove difficult as the younger partner progresses through that decade. Person’s in their 30’s, 40’s, & 50’s are more likely to be in more complementary stages of life where differences in age might be mitigated by circumstances (ie: child-rearing, careers).

Older guys definately have higher social value and are more mature. Fatter incomes, more assets, experience, wisdom, and well traveled and higher EQ, not mention more time as they likely work less or can take early retirement as they have more money. I see why younger women go for older men and I see it all the time online. These young women who are not ready to settle down and pick out older, mature men. Not to mention women are waiting longer these days to have children and families, so what is wrong with dating an older man for a few years before settling down?

About post #22. I agree that it is a waste of time. I’ve been in that kind of loop in my life before. You are so consumed with venting your emotions ( over and over again ) and so obsessed with getting other people to validate your experience that you don’t see that you are caught in an time wasting loop of fruitless repeated experiences. You don’t see that you aren’t moving forward.

If you can’t see the problem, you can’t fix it.

The problem isn’t that reality is unfair. It is unfair for everyone. People who are happy despite a given issue are happy because they work with reality as it is rather than demanding to be validated.

I think this is a really ridiculous topic. I can’t imagine why any younger woman would want an older man. In fact, assuming that women get smarter as they get older, why would any woman want an older man considering older men are so inherantly so unattractive? An older man as compared to a younger man is generally smarter, more financially secure, a more experienced lover and diaper changer. He’s more experienced at resolving child behavior problems, not so easily frazzled when most other problems in life arise, and better at knowing what women in general want and in communicating with his woman to ascertain what his woman actually wants… and possibly even more interested in providing his woman what she wants if she’s providing him what he wants from the relationship, than a younger man would in many cases.

The things younger men have over older men seem to be more stamina in bed and a younger body. I can totally understand why, to most women, how these could totally overpower all the advantages previously mentioned older men generally have over younger men. I can totally understand why women would look down on all these properties of older men over the younger men’s advantages.

What I totally don’t understand is the difference in their stage in life as mentioned before and how that should make much of a difference. Whether a woman stays home or works outside the home, both a man and woman most of the time spend most of their time separated, seeking differing individual goals in the individual work they do daily. Regardless of age, they still both eat and seek entertainment in between the time they aren’t working separately. They still, regardless of age, go to movies, attend entertainment venues that they have in common, take care of their pets and children, etc, etc. So if they determine that they have many similar interests, why would age make a difference considering men and women are, by nature, very different to begin with? Seems to me that any differences between an older man and younger woman are very often common among men and women of similar ages, considering that all men are different and all women are different. So why couldn’t younger women find older men who are very compatible with them?

One more question. Considering that most marriages in this country end within a relatively short amount of time, is it possible that we are doing things wrong? I wonder which relationships actually last longer on average… couples who are within a few years of age or those with much wider differences in age. Would we be better off if all young women married much older men and then later in life when older, marry much younger men?

Sometimes, just sometimes, the woman listens to her body clock and actually wants to use her body the way it was built … to have a couple of babies. Their is a shortage of men who have the maturity and integrity to hang around to be the father for their children. So, when a woman finds a man who will, she just might … actually … jump at the chance, even if he actually is a little older than her father!

Do-gooders say that she should do without … usually the do-gooders already have their own spouse and children, and demand that single women do without. Shame that the do-gooders do not have the integrity that the older man has !

According to British census data, large age difference marriages in both directions last longer than small ones. About as many women chose to marry much younger men as choose much older men. The numbers are small compared to people who marry with a two year age gap (which has by far the highest 20 year divorce rate). My first wife was 5 years older than me my new one is 24 years younger. Age was immaterial both times. Now flak about child rearing that was a serious issue.

I don’t know what “British census data” you are referencing, but the studies I have read–and I’ve read a LOT of them since it is my field–say you have it exactly backwards.

Statistically (and controlling for other factors), if a couple has a one year age difference, the risk of divorce increases to 3 percent (from O percent if they are the exact same age). The relative risk of divoce with a 5-year age difference goes up to 18 percent. With a 10-year age difference, risk of divorce increases by almost 40 percent. With a 15 year age difference, relative risk of divorce goes up at least 10 more percent points. With a 20-year age difference, relative risk of divorce increases to over 90 percent.

This study’s results, stated generally above, were done in the US . It did not matter whether the female or male was older. POINT: The statistical risk of divorce sharply rises with age gaps in marriage partners. The bigger the age gap, the higher the rate of divorce (controlling to the degree possible for other factors). Not saying this is a “cause and effect”…just that there is a strong correlation.

I do not agree that 28 year old women have the most choices in men. A lot of smart men want well educated doctor-lawyer-professionally successful wives who still look hot at 50 plus years of age. (There are still quite a few women like that…think Christy Brinkley at age 61.) Do you think men in their fifties are really more attracted to women their daughters ages? (Sorry….some are initially…but they end up marrying within their OWN age bracket most of the time. NOT because they couldn’t get somebody younger…but because they want somebody they can relate to and who challenges them…and who remembers where they were when Jim Morrison died…and when President Kennedy was shot.)

When you are 25 and super good looking (I know and remember) you THINK that older men want you….but they really want somebody who is more sophisticated that you! And more interesting.

Work on your INNER beauty…and stop worrying about the wrinkles. Keep yourself fit and healthy and stop reading STUPID STUPID articles such as this one. Don’t waste your precious time on this guy’s columns. It’s for teeny boppers.

Although, I agree with almost everything you have posted. Lol, I would disagree with one specific area. With regards to stamina and bodies. I am 45 and honestly, I find that men my age have way and I mean way better bodies and stamina than younger men. We are at our prime. We lift more, we run more, our tone is better, and et cetera. Especially in this video game stay home need a mom age that young men live in today. I am in the US army and frankly, I am very embarrassed to see boys from 18 to 30 that well (not to seem to sexist) are girls. They are fat, out of shape whinny and need someone to take care of them at all times. Its an age of entitlement, where they expect everything to be given to them as if they deserve it. Hard work is a think of the past and well women are the new man. And when it comes to intimate encounters, well again younger men are lacking. Of my personal life, I get young 20 year old women weekly asking for my number. Its flattering but I understand that women want a man. They don’t want a boy most of the time that they have to take care of . Up here in Alaska, women are diverse and independent. Some of the most petite beautiful creatures can be often found, hunting and fishing and living in the woods all by themselves. It an amazing time and woman have found equality and are taking advantage of it. Just my two cents, if it made sense that is. Have a great day!

“They still, regardless of age, go to movies, attend entertainment venues that they have in common, take care of their pets and children, etc, etc. So if they determine that they have many similar interests, why would age make a difference considering men and women are, by nature, very different to begin with? Seems to me that any differences between an older man and younger woman are very often common among men and women of similar ages, considering that all men are different and all women are different. So why couldn’t younger women find older men who are very compatible with them?”

I’m 27 and I find older men incredibly attractive. I had a crush on my father’s friend growing up and I still think he’s one of the most attractive older men I have ever met. The thing is, he was also smart and interesting. I think that is what attracts me to older men. They are so much more mature, interesting, and self aware than men my age. Most of the men my age I have met like to party. I don’t. They like to take pictures with as many hot looking girls as they can find and post them on facebook and myspace for everyone to see how cool that makes them. I’m not saying they’re all like that but I have met my share. In general I just think oder men have more to offer a woman than a 25-35 yr old does.

There are lots of exceptions. Not all men are the average at say, 65 or so, as their peers. So many men have never taken care of themselves and or have bad genes and are what most consider average or normal. If one is and has been into physical activities all their life, that makes a big difference, unless they have fallen claim to things like diabetes, high blood pressure gone unchecked, and all the things that can go wrong for either sex. My GF just 2 years younger, and so wonderful a person and very attractive and sexual at 70, died from ALS. She had no control over that. Women want security and so they follow that. But, they need all the good things that go with a relationship (Marriage) too. Men want security too.

come back ten years from when you are 37 and tell me your dream man is a 55 year old. Ha!

Paula – Exactly! When I was 30; I dated men 10 years older than me thinking this was smart… Now I am 34 and like my man two years older… Men think they are so young at heart … Not so! They age quickly! Current bf is active and the intimacy is wayyy better than my plus 40 boyfriend; we are so compatibilitle! Not to mention, older bf liked his texting girlfriend on the side. No thanks…

I agree completely! love the interesting topics hes interested in how he understands and listens he has tons of crazy stories hes very self aware always puts others first. He mirrors my personality.sometimes I feel like a 45 year old in a 22 year old body. I dont fit in with my generation. Hes 58 and has lived through things I would love to experiance. everyone my own age is mostly superficial and looking for a quick bang i have no time or patience for the drama of a young relationship I need understanding intelligence and knowing that he is capable of standing on his own two feet. I have my own life to worry about I dont need to be worrying about if my young boyfriend will finish school get a job and be able to support himself I got stuck supporting two imbeciles for about a year each definitely put my life on backtrack (had three long term and it was miserable though i did learn alot about myself!) Neither of us were looking for each other we just happened to become good friends and it went from there. People may argue that having a family is near impossible for a such an age gap and maybe thas true but its not when you dont want one! Say what you may but i am a free spirit have plans for my own future and that does not consist of a youngin. I havnt the time. Thats 18+ years I could be working on my own dreams. Besides why would i make an innocent child suffer in this screwed up world that society has created. No thank you i dont like it here so im not going to make someone else suffer. Whether we have 5 years or if we have 30 years together I know this connection is deep and worth it. For those who have Never loved unconditionally on a soul level will not understand nor will they be expected to understand. They are young souls who need to develop but I feel if you find someone who treats you well challenges your mind enjoys adventures and loves you for you what is stopping you from being together? Nobody and nothing. Not only is he my “soul mate” he has also been my best friend since way before we were together and I am grateful for every moment we get to spend together confusing the heck out of people while we look deeply into each other knowing what we have is real and right.

I LOVE THIS! This is definitely how I feel. I’m not sure of your age gap. But I’m 23 and my boyfriend is 50. I’m definitely a 45 year old in a 23 year old body. We click on every level and the love is so pure and passionate between us that the age thing never crosses my mind. I don’t have to worry about if he’s out cheating or going to quit his job. All of those trivial things my sisters worry about with their boyfriends. He completes me and he is my soul mate. I absolutely adore him and I am his universe. I love how passionate he is and how youthful he is.

@Nina: There you have it! Younger women like older guys because of their social value, and older guys like younger women because of their hotness and energy. Attraction in a nutshell.

I don’t think it’s true that women these days like men simply because of their social value. This is a harsh truth for many men to swallow, but looks are important. A guy can be wealthy and powerful, but I am not going to be sexually attracted to him if he is bald, old, goofy looking, or out of shape. I am happy with my wealth and position in society, so I don’t need his. I can understand how poor/powerless/insecure women go for such men out survival instincts, but is that what you really want? Plus, when much older men hit on me (purely because of my age), it just comes across as insecure and entitled, and that is a bigger turn off than the bald head and gut.

Things is, at lot of that “social value” was established because women were at an economic disadvantage. Younger women leaned toward men with more stability, i.e., older men, because they HAD to. Now that the wage gap is closing and more women are establishing their own careers, you will see the same standards being applied to men that women have lived with all along. Looks, vitality, Youth, health. We like all those things in our men just as you men like them in us. Prepare to be judged by the standards you have been using to judge others. Once women can support themselves sufficiently without you do you think looks aren’t going to play a big role in who they choose to date?

I’d put it this way — relationships that are only about sex are very boring. If a guy sees a woman as “only three holes” he is boring. You do not want to spend time with him in relationship — but it’s good to know there are guys like that out there if you need a booty call. They are easy. At some point guys figure this out and they become immensely attractive as life partners — because well, maybe women want both sex AND relationship. Until the young bucks figure this out, they are just not worth the time of day. Things that men can find in relationship with a woman besides the “three holes”: laughter, companionship, intelligence, warmth, comfort, a family, a partner in building wealth, a caregiver, an ally, a buddy, another driver on long road trips.

By figuring “this” out I meant that relationships that are only about sex are boring. That relationship can offer more than that.

I am 44 and have younger girl FRIENDS. We go out to eat, watch movies or try new things. AS FRIENDS. We are comfortable enough to be able to snuggle and walk with arms around each other without any thought of it meaning more than what it is. Just human contact. We all crave human touch and it is nice to be able to get it without being or feeling pressure to be romantically involved.

At this point in my life a friend is more important to me than a relationship and I have found that if I try to have just a friendship with women my own age, that is not what they are looking for.

My point is, just because you see an older man out with a younger girl and even if they have their arms around each other, it doesn’t mean anything. Frankly, none of anyone elses business either.

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